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How could Scotland remain in the EU on conditions previously agreed with the UK?
Scotland or at least a percentage of the population wants the power to control their own destiny.
The people of Scotland voted in the independence referendum to remain in the union with England because Britain was an EU member.
The Brexit vote changed those parameters and Scotland in my view should be given a second chance to decide their own future.
_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn
Time is the fire in which we burn.
Delmore Schwartz.
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"Scotland or at least a percentage of the population wants the power to control their own destiny."
You really think they will be masters of their destiny tied to the ECB governing financial policy and in the Euro, just like Greece.
Flying elephants comes to mind.
Scotland will certainly not be independent IF Nicola gets her way.
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Maybe or maybe not but at least the people of Scotland should be able to decide their future outside the EU for themselves. Or do you believe England and Mrs May are the masters who know what's best for the people of Scotland?
_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn
Time is the fire in which we burn.
Delmore Schwartz.
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Do you think that much of this, given the current Scottish economic realities, could be posturing to get the next best thing to independence which would be a large handout from the non continuence of paying into Europe, following the negotiations ( or as part of the negotiations)?
Another question....Do all new members of the EU now have to comply with joining the eurozone and/ or be part of the Schengen agreement?
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"The people of Scotland should be able to decide their future outside the EU for themselves"
Mickey, Theresa May has not said she will not allow another referendum for Scotland. Once the UK are outside the EU, from what Theresa May has said, she will consider another Scottish referendum, but NOT while exit negotiations are continuing with the EU.
That is not " the masters who know what's best for the people of Scotland?" A referendum is not totally ruled out post Brexit.
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Sturgeon and Salmon are not being truthful with the people of Scotland ...they have not mentioned anything about the yearly escalating membership fee of approximately 4 billion pounds that the Scottish tax payer will fund and the fact that they will not be able to control the emigration from the EU ... all subsidies will stop from the UK immediately when Scotland leave's the Union can you picture the Union Jack without the blue.( god forbid ). Mary Doll and Rab C Nesbit will have a lot to answer for.
This message was last edited by windtalker on 18/03/2017.
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Sturgeon and Salmond? Windtalker have you noticed you seem to have to be named after a fish to be a Scottish politician? 
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Correct ( something fishy about them.).
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Correct ( something fishy about them.).i think they are Pollock's or are they Pillocks.
This message was last edited by windtalker on 18/03/2017.
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“Scotland isn’t full up, If you are as appalled as we are at the path this Westminster Government is taking, come and join us. Come here to live, work, invest or study. Come to Scotland and be part of building a modern, progressive, outward-looking, compassionate country.”
Nicola Sturgeon 18 March.
The Scottish people want a constructive say in the Brexit process. Unless they have the power of independence it will be impossible. Why should Scotland be taken out of the EU against it's majority wish and without any influence in the negotiations?
It is in my view only a matter of time that Scotland leaves the Union with England and applies to become an EU member. It may take at least a decade but Brexit has now made that process unstoppable. It has also made a united Ireland more feasible as the people of Northern Ireland look to Europe not Westminster for their future.
English nationalism come with a high price tag.
The times they are a changing.
_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn
Time is the fire in which we burn.
Delmore Schwartz.
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Mickey, once again you show a disregard for the actual position of the UK including Scotland, with leaving the EU. Just as Nicola Sturgeon will not see it, the UK as an entity voted as a majority to leave the EU. This vote included the Scottish people and was a democratic vote. They have to leave with England and Wales and Northern Ireland because , as i pointed out previously, we all went in togethr. How could the UK exit without Scotland also, when the UK as a whole joined? it is like having a joint bank account, both parties are liable for the account until one or another party leaves, and only then is the account useable by the remaining person. It is the same with Scotland. How would Scotland feel to be solely responsible for agreements made with the EU if it remained when the UK left? Scotland HAS to leave with the UK, and afterwards negotiate its own membership with the EU on new terms , not previously agreed.
Wether the Scottish vote for independence, or to rejoin the EU is up to them, but until the UK leaves as a complete entity, Scotland remains a UK partner. Also, Mickey, you consider your self to be intelligent, can you not see it is all just Nicola Sturgeons agenda, not the Scottish peoples? Just as her predecessor, Alex Salmond tried, but he stepped down and allowed his puppet , Nicola Sturgeon do the shouting. He is clever, he will not take the fall, she will, but you can bet he is driving her like a ventriloquists dummy, just that he has his hand much further up. It will all end in tears.
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Mickey you also quote Nicola Sturgeon, "Come to Scotland and be part of building a modern, progressive, outward-looking, compassionate country.”
A modern progressive outward looking compassionate country? what a load of drivel, if she was progressive and outward looking she would be looking for the best possible deal for Scotland, and if it means staying with the rest of the UK she should embrace it, but her Patriotic drum banging will not let her even countenance this. Scotland might be what she says but she most certainly isnt. She threatens everything she claims to stand for by the very way she makes unresonable demands, and she knows it. It is a very sharp blade she is trying to balance on, and for her the fall will be very painful.
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Mickyfinn you said the magic word MAJORITY this word is very important to people that live in a DEMOCRACY. and it is not the people of Scotland that want to leave the UK Union the good people of Scotland had a referendum in 2014 and voted to against leaving the Union ...it is the SNP that want dragScotland out of the Union by trying to force the people it to referendum after referendum until they (SNP)get the result they want....if you can remember back when Southern Ireland voted to leave the EU the so called Democratic Political Establishment that runs Southern Ireland would not accept the vote so they forced the people of Ireland to vote yes by having referendum after referendum until they got the vote they wanted the people of Southern Ireland got beaten into submission by a political establishment that did not know and still does not know how to run the country affairs themselves .
Anyway we will have another two years of this Political ( bullshit) to put up with it will be getting rammed down our throats to a point that we will be thankful it is all over so I have made a promise to myself to get on with my life and just take what I am given by the MAJORITY in this DEMOCRACY that I live in this will be my last post on this subject see you two years ( the end.).
This message was last edited by windtalker on 19/03/2017.
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thereby speaks a voice of reason.......
P.s A democratic person may not agree with the majority, but being democratic, agrees to go with the Majority. (Nicola Sturgeon take note)
This message was last edited by robertt8696 on 19/03/2017.
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On the face of it the Scotland independence question will be a dagger in th side for the negotiations and may cost Scotland on the very subject sturgeon wants to make better for them as a nation.
The EU have some pretty choice characters in the executive and they will play the small Scottish matt r off against the UK during negotiations. They can't promise sturgeon anything, but they will try to keep her dangling.
I think the phrase for fish people is they will do her up like a kipper.
She will just try and make herself look important and try and influence Scottish people at a time they have most to lose and very little to gain. Imagine trying to establish borders and a currency, trade deals and applications for membership as a newly formed small nation country. Wow what a stiff task, but if it's not imposed on you, why would you choose it at this time?
Shes dangerous and misguided I think.
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Best wishes, Brian
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Scotland is a nation that chooses to be in a union with England. It is not part of a greater England. It has its own legal system language and culture. It is also has a devolved political administration with its own elected parliament.
Gordon Brown has recently suggested a third way. More devolved powers to include tax raising abilities but that's unlikely to dissuade the SNP from independence.
It cannot be right that largely the English electorate dictate the direction of a separate nations future outside the EU without firstly that nation indicating what they wish to do or have a say in how it’s done.
Gordon Brown has recently suggested a third way. More devolved powers to include tax raising abilities but that's unlikely to dissuade the SNP from still wanting independence.
If Mrs May involves the SNP in the Brexit negotiations with meaningful influence for Scotland that may persuade Sturgeon not to pursue the referendum. To me that would be the obvious statesman like thing to do.
I see a general election looming ever closer.
_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn
Time is the fire in which we burn.
Delmore Schwartz.
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Well. We may watch this with interest but Scotland came into the EU with us, and I don't know the nation vote split then, and it's not really relevant now, until after the article has been invoked and the negotiations take place.
if it's OK for the EU th say we don't talk about it until after the article has been invoked, then it's OK for parliament to say the same.
Sturgeon wants one thing, independence. I am very much in favour of Scotland being independent at the earliest opportunity and I think most ordinary people are now. To choose now to do this is completely crackers, if she waits and has some fears that negotiations aren't going well, she will have a much stronger case, and it will show she wants to be dissruptive to the Engiish too.
Win Win for the sturgeon.
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Best wishes, Brian
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It could be that NS fears a good outcome for the UK, and it may sway some of her supporters after Brexit.
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That's a positive argument tenerife. Lets hold on to that/
_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn
Time is the fire in which we burn.
Delmore Schwartz.
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But not for Her and Salmond.
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