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Residencial Santa Ana del Monte forum threads
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06 Jun 2008 9:43 PM by Darren_Michelle Star rating. 167 forum posts Send private message

Ok...tell you what I don't know why we bother , Briando,I'll stop posting what we hear this end and allow the 'pessimists' to post instead, obviously you are in a far better position to advise than we can.

best of luck everyone !




This message was last edited by Darren_Michelle on 6/6/2008.


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06 Jun 2008 9:52 PM by briando55 Star rating in Yorkshire. 1982 forum posts Send private message

Hi Darren

Sorry to have upset you, i didnt realise you were an expert, i thought you were speculating as well.

Who is it thats buying the hotel and what stage is the purchase at,

If it is bought in the near future what level of business can it expect and is it a thriving concern straight away?  Can they secure the funding needed to buy it, is the land it stands on available to sell or is it under the scrutiny of the administrators?

Maybe i have the wrong image of this hotel, is it off the site etc?

Regards  Brian

_______________________

Best wishes, Brian

 



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06 Jun 2008 9:53 PM by brianmags Star rating in London. 380 forum posts Send private message

Hi Darren_Michelle,
                     don't get exsasperated keep up th ethe good work news from spain direct is good .
as for the professor comment we got the same from a well respected solicttor as well please lets not start fighting each other again or is it a weekend thing
Brianmags



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06 Jun 2008 9:58 PM by briando55 Star rating in Yorkshire. 1982 forum posts Send private message

Hi Darren

Sorry but i am not advising, just trying to be objective.  

I am carefull not to try and instruct or influence people, just to explore angles. 

_______________________

Best wishes, Brian

 



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06 Jun 2008 10:15 PM by joanniemac Star rating. 241 forum posts Send private message

Hi Darren-Michelle,We agree with Brianmags, keep up the good work.Always good to read your posts! Dont let one bad apple put you off.There are plenty of people glad of the information you have posted.Cheers Joanniemac


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06 Jun 2008 10:24 PM by TonyMal Star rating in Oxfordshire. 1090 forum posts Send private message

Hi joanniemac,

You beat me to saying that, so I second your comment!

We are becoming a community and a lot and I do mean a lot of people have joined SARC. THis is a residents group before we have our homes and that is quite unique but we have the goal to have our homes and a community to live in. Saying that, I beleive that it is important that we respect that there may be differing view points even though the most important one to a lot of us is....

I want my House!

I have just come form a graphic artist and we now have art work for T shirts etc. We also have admin support  and a webmaster free of charge for SARC.

santaanadelmonte@hotmail.com

Tony  R17 18




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06 Jun 2008 11:02 PM by sunworshiper Star rating. 2 forum posts Send private message

    Fortuna, Spain - Lush fields of lettuce and hothouses of tomatoes line the roads. Verdant new developments of plush pastel vacation homes beckon buyers from Britain and Germany. Golf courses - 54 of them, all built in the last decade and most in the last three years - give way to the beach. At last, this hardscrabble corner of southeast Spain is thriving.

    There is only one problem with the picture of bounty: this province, Murcia, is running out of water. Spurred on by global warming and poorly planned development, swaths of southeast Spain are steadily turning into desert.

    Murcia, traditionally a poor farming region, has undergone a resort-building boom in recent years, even as many of its farmers have switched to more thirsty crops, encouraged by water transfer schemes, which have become increasingly untenable. The combination has put new pressures on the land and its dwindling supply of water.

    This year farmers are fighting developers over water rights. They are fighting one another over who gets to water their crops. And in a sign of their mounting desperation, they are buying and selling water like gold on a burgeoning black market, mostly from illegal wells.

    Southern Spain has long been plagued by cyclical drought, but the current crisis, scientists say, probably reflects a more permanent climate change brought on by global warming. And it is a harbinger of a new kind of conflict.

    The battles of yesterday were fought over land, they warn. Those of the present center on oil. But those of the future - a future made hotter and dryer by climate change in much of the world - seem likely to focus on water, they say.

    "Water will be the environmental issue this year - the problem is urgent and immediate," said Barbara Helferrich, a spokeswoman for the European Union's Environment Directorate. "If you already have water shortages in spring, you know it's going to be a really bad summer."

    Dozens of world leaders will be meeting at the United Nations Food and Agriculture Organization headquarters in Rome starting Tuesday to address a global food crisis caused part by water shortages in Africa, Australia and here in southern Spain.

    Climate change means that creeping deserts may eventually drive 135 million people off their land, the Spain estimates. Most of them are in the developing world. But southern Europe is experiencing the problem now, its climate drying to the point that it is becoming more like Africa's, scientists say.

    For Murcia, the water crisis has come already. And its arrival has been accelerated by developers and farmers who have hewed to water-hungry ventures highly unsuited to a drier, warmer climate: crops like lettuce that need ample irrigation; resorts that promise a swimming pool in the backyard; acres of freshly sodded golf courses that sop up millions of gallons a day.

    "I come under a lot of pressure to release water from farmers and also from developers," said Antonio Pérez Gracia, the water manager for Fortuna, sipping coffee with farmers in a bar in the town's dusty square on a recent morning. He rued the fact that he could provide each property owner with only 30 percent of its government-determined water allotment.

    "I'm not sure what we'll do this summer," he added, noting that the local aquifer was sinking so quickly that the pumps would not reach it soon. "I come under a lot of pressure to release water, from farmers and also from developers. They can complain as much as they want, but if there's no more water, there's no more water."

    Rubén Vives, a farmer who relies on Mr. Pérez Gracia's largess, said he could not afford the current black market water prices. "This year, my livelihood is in danger," said Mr. Vives, who has farmed low-water crops like lemons here for nearly two decades.

    The hundreds of thousands of wells - most of them illegal - that have in the past provided a temporary reprieve from thirst have depleted underground water to the point of no return. Water from northern Spain that was once transferred here has also slowed to a trickle, as wetter northern provinces are drying up, too.

    The scramble for water has set off scandals. Local officials are in prison for taking payoffs to grant building permits in places where there is not adequate water. Chema Gil, a journalist who exposed one such scheme, has been subject to death threats, carries pepper spray and is guarded day and night be the Guardia Civil, a police force with military and civilian functions.

    "The model of Murcia is completely unsustainable," said Mr. Gil. "We consume two and a half times more water than the system can recover. So where do you get it? Import it from elsewhere? Dry up the aquifer? With climate change we're heading into a cul-de-sac. All the water we're using to water lettuce and golf courses will be needed just to drink."

    Facing a national crisis, Spain has become something of an unwitting laboratory, sponsoring a European conference on water issues this summer and this year announcing a national action plan to fight desertification. That plan includes a shift to more efficient methods of irrigation, as well as an extensive program of desalinization plants to provide the fresh water that nature does not.

    The Spanish Environment Ministry estimates that one-third of the county is at risk of turning into desert from a combination of climate change and poor land use.

    Still, national officials visibly stiffen when asked about the "Africanization" of Spain's climate - a term now common among scientists.

    "We are in much better shape than Africa, but within the E.U. our situation is serious," said Antonio Serrano Rodríguez, the secretary general for land and biodiversity at Spain's Environment Ministry.

    Still, Mr. Serrano and others acknowledge the broad outlines of the problem. "There will be places that can't be farmed any more, that were marginal and are now useless," Mr. Serrano said. "We have parts of the country that are close to the limit."

    While southern Spain has always been dry and plagued by cyclical droughts, the average surface temperature in Spain has risen 2.7 degrees compared to about 1.4 degrees globally since 1880, records show.

    Rainfall here is predicted to fall 20 percent from this year to 2020, and 40 percent by 2070, according to United Nations projections.

    The changes on the Almarcha family farm in Albanilla over the past three decades are a testament to that hotter, drier climate here. Until two decades ago, the farm grew wheat and barley, watered only by rain. As rainfall dropped, Carlo Almarcha, 51, switched to growing almonds.

    About 10 years ago, he quit almonds and changed to organic peaches and pears, "since they need less water," he explained. Recently he took up olives and figs, "which resist drought and are less sensitive to weather."

    Mr. Almarcha participates in a government water trading system, started last year, in which farmers pay three times the normal price - 33 cents instead of 12 per cubic meter - to get extra water. The black market rate is even higher. Still, his outlook is bleak.

    "You used to know that this week in spring there will be rain," he said, his work boots standing on parched soil of an olive grove that was once a wheat field. "Now you never know when or if it will come. Also, there's no winter any more and plants need cold to rest. So there's less growth. Sometimes none. Even plants all seem confused."

    While Mr. Almarcha has gradually moved toward less thirsty crops, the government's previous water transfer plans have moved many farmers in the opposite direction. The farmers have shifted to producing a wide range of water-hungry fruits and vegetables that had never been grown in the south. Murcia is traditionally known for figs and date palms.

    "You can't grow strawberries naturally in Huelva - its too hot," said Raquel Montón, a climate specialist at Greenpeace in Madrid, referring to the nearby strawberry capital of Spain. "In Sarragosa, which is a desert, we grow corn, the most water thirsty crop. It's insane. The only thing that would be more insane is putting up casinos and golf courses." Which, of course, Murcia has.

    In 2001, a new land use law in Murcia made it far easier for residents to sell land for resort development. Though southern Spain has long had elaborate systems for managing its relatively scarce water, today everyone, it seems, has found ways to get around them.

    Grass on golf courses or surrounding villas is sometimes labeled a "crop," making owners eligible for water that would not be allocated to keep leisure space green. Foreign investors plant a few trees and call their holiday homes "farms" so they are eligible for irrigation water, Mr. Pérez Gracia said.

    "Once a property owner's got a water allotment, he asks for a change of land use," he explained. "Then he's got his property and he's got his water. It's supposed to be for irrigation, but people use it for what they want. No one knows if it goes to a swimming pool."

    While he said his "heart goes out to the real farmers," he does not have the personnel to monitor how people use their allotments.

    With so much money to be made, officials set aside laws and policies that might encourage sustainable development, Mr. Gil, the journalist, said. At first, he was vilified in the community when he wrote articles critical of the developments. Recently, as people are discovering that the water is running out, the attitude is shifting.

    But even so, people and politicians tend to regard water as a limitless resource. "Politicians think in four-year blocks, so it's O.K. as long as it doesn't run out on their watch," Ms. Montón of Greenpeace said. "People think about it, but they don't really think about what happens tomorrow. They don't worry until they turn on the tap and nothing flows."




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06 Jun 2008 11:15 PM by brianmags Star rating in London. 380 forum posts Send private message


Dear Sunworshiper
                                 Thanks for the party political broadcast on behalf of the Green Party but please be aware this is a serious forum about peoples whose investments and dearms are in a turmoil at the moment and are worried if they are going to loose everthing. Your broadcast is more suited to the general forum.
                           While it is quite edificial it is not  appreciated in this context.
But it was put to gether quite well have you thought abut a Job in polotics writting speeches
regards 
Brianmags R4 556
we want our house


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06 Jun 2008 11:19 PM by TonyMal Star rating in Oxfordshire. 1090 forum posts Send private message

Hi Sunworshiper,
Thank you for the eco warrior entry, nothing to do with the thread but thank you any way.  It is a shame that when puting something on that may or may not have scientifc merit to its content you did not state references etc. I suggest you read "Blue print for survival" published by the Ecologist in the mid 1970's. But what has that to do with the migration of man and..............................I want my house?
All the best
Tony R17 18


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06 Jun 2008 11:25 PM by briando55 Star rating in Yorkshire. 1982 forum posts Send private message

Hi

I thought it was a very powerful post and is part of the information we should be aware of. 

Can anyone shoot the information to bits? I have a feeling the administrators and banks will have a strong lobby on those kind of facts.

Whats the score on the environmental issues, its only been touched on and then dismissed, everything has been socio economic so far?





_______________________

Best wishes, Brian

 



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06 Jun 2008 11:30 PM by briando55 Star rating in Yorkshire. 1982 forum posts Send private message

Hi Tony

I dont get the blue print for survival thing, mid 1970's, are you saying sun worshiper read it...or suggesting she reads it?

I read Von Daniken in the mid 1970's....I still have nightmares about spacemen coming to get me...lol

Whats the blue print thing?


_______________________

Best wishes, Brian

 



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06 Jun 2008 11:34 PM by sunworshiper Star rating. 2 forum posts Send private message

06 Jun 2008 11:48 PM by briando55 Star rating in Yorkshire. 1982 forum posts Send private message

Sunworshiper

Im having a bacardi and coke, pull up a chair and you can have one here.  Dont be thirsty.

I play golf sunworshiper......i want to play in Spain...the nice men in Spain said i could and they sold me a house to live in and play golf.  Now they say it may not happen cos the builder is running out of money.  We are not political animals...just people.

I am trying to make some sense of it, and here you come and tell me your running out of water....well i was in Yorkshire last year fighting floods and rescuing people and properties, i have a commendation for it.  I can play as much golf as i want over here, but we dont have as much sunshine.

So life is a trade off y'now....Spain wants our money, we want its climate.  There is the way of life, culture, history...all the other things that excite us too...we want to share.

I wish i had spent more time in physics class at uni, i could give you a decent shot at water provision.  I dont think you know and i dont think the politicians know.

One thing is for sure.....we have all invested in our own little Spanish dream...and Spain said it can give us it.  

Your going to have to find some water eh Sunworshiper

 





_______________________

Best wishes, Brian

 



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07 Jun 2008 7:20 AM by Darren_Michelle Star rating. 167 forum posts Send private message

Just for the record, due to the recent inclement weather experienced over much of Spain and in particular the South East region, reservoir water levels are back up to minimum 40% levels therefore alleviating any immediate crisis...............but who can speak for the future !

Still, bet you knew that already !


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07 Jun 2008 7:50 AM by sarah12345 Star rating. 29 forum posts Send private message

glad to see you've put your toys back in your pram darren. Is this fact or did san jose tell you? (as you live over them and are very well informed!)

If you are so confident then where did your advert go from the top of this page?


This message was last edited by sarah12345 on 6/7/2008.


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07 Jun 2008 8:54 AM by Darren_Michelle Star rating. 167 forum posts Send private message

Sarah,

Don't worry, my comments were not a sign of petulance so no toys got thrown out. Ever since we have been contributing to this forum, we have posted both positive and negative messages whenever the information has been gathered. For your information, we have neither stated whether we want our home or not so cannot be catogorised in either camp, that decision is ours and ours alone and should have no baring on anyone elses situation or decision. All I chose to do was pass through some information that had come to us for the benefit of those who are optimistic it will go ahead, similarly I would have posted...and have, to the pessimists who do not think it will happen. I have offered my opinion to many in PM to seek Power of Attorney but I am no expert nor try to portray so, but neither do I try to challenge those who post messages on here which are contary to my beliefs and understanding. What I was saying is that if I post a message and all it attracts is challenging responses, then i won't bother, I have more important things to be getting on with.

we are all individual and whereby this forum is a good media to share information, both good and bad, people will do what is right for them at the end of the day in their own individual circumstances i.e i have my own solicitor......do you? have i told you to use mine or anyone elses....no ! If those that wish to follow someone elses guidance do so, then it's the risk they take and not for you or i to try and act as God and save them from this path, be it right or wrong. The information i share is factual to the best of our intentions, if you or others do not wish to take it on board, you are not being forced, like the tv, if you dont like the program...turn it off, no-one is forcing you or others to accept what you are being told. As for living over San Jose, has it's benefits as it has it's drawbacks but at least i am on hand to drop into both this office and orihuela on a regular basis to find out information for myself. let me ask you, how frequently have you had a face to face with SJG regarding your position??? if not many, why are you worrying about what others are doing rather than focusing on yourself. Please do not take this as a direct attack on yourself, I'm also amazed and pessimistic why so many people who stand to lose so much money opt to take advise from on here rather than getting a £100.00 flight over and asking San Jose directly. I have made many friends on here over the last 3 years and therefore out of choice, I help those friends out by asking questions on their behalf because i am in close proximity to do so.

as for the source of the information, the President of the Regional Government, La Generalitat, Jose Montilla has stated he will be happy to cancel the planned new water transfer pipe from Barcelona based upon current water levels being sufficient to guarantee supply. that information is readily available on the internet and across the regional newspapers in Spain, I am no weather forecaster so I cannot say if that position will change before you ask.

regarding the advert, it was our decision based upon the delays to re-focus our attention on our coastal business, The Spanish Property Management Experts and put santa ana on the back-burner until decisions have been made. As i say, that was our decision and no-one elses so please do not read anything into it or cast suspicion as to why.

Hope that helps.

Darren




This message was last edited by Darren_Michelle on 6/7/2008.

This message was last edited by Darren_Michelle on 6/7/2008.

This message was last edited by Darren_Michelle on 6/7/2008.

This message was last edited by Darren_Michelle on 6/7/2008.


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07 Jun 2008 9:54 AM by KayT Star rating. 38 forum posts Send private message

Nice to hear from you Darren and Michelle, we were wondering where you had gone. 
Thanks for keeping us informed. 
Kay and Malcolm


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07 Jun 2008 10:40 AM by js Star rating. 24 forum posts Send private message

There is no hotel on El Pinet, just a piece of land which at one time was going to be a school.  It is not the place where you would have a hotel on an unfinished site, can't see any call for it, ample accommodation in the village.  It would be nice to get the houses and apartments finished.


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07 Jun 2008 11:02 AM by Darren_Michelle Star rating. 167 forum posts Send private message

js

take your comments on board, you may wish to ask for San Jose's and the Administrators comments regarding the hotel as it appears they have received an offer in principle for a Hotel planned for the El Pinet urbanisation. I very much doubt that both Administrators and San Jose would raise pure speculation if it didnt have some foundation of truth. Only passing on what we are hearing, our neighbours have bought on that urbanisation and they know of a planned hotel as well.

Darren


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07 Jun 2008 11:04 AM by Dave.R Star rating. 101 forum posts Send private message

Dave.R´s avatar

Hi All,
there seems to be a lot of fears amongst people and the reason behind this is does anyone actually know what the process of the administrators is. i think it may evaluate fears if San Jose were to put out a notifications stating exactly what the administrators are doing and maybe put the following into the letter.

what are the administrators currently doing ?
How long do they have to do it ?
who do they report back to ?
what happens after they report back there findings ?
who will report these findings back to us the buyers ?
what should we the creditors be doing now ?
do we the buyers need to produce our documents to the courts ?
do people have a choice of money back if the findings say the build will proceed ?

to many questions still not replied to and to many people making assumptions. i for one will not make a decision until these have been answered and i have asked the questions of san jose but so far no reply.

Darren perhaps you could pop downstairs into there office and ask them to send out a notification detailing what the process of the administrators are and what the next steps are and what we should be doing now.



_______________________
R10 160 and Calasparra


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