Is living in Spain really that bad now???

Watching the very early world business news this morning, it was stated that economically, Spain is in a dire situation, far worse than Greece, Portugal or Ireland.  Spain has 20% unemployment.  For youg people/families wanting a better life than they think the UK can offer, surely Spain is not an option.   If all you want is sunshine then I'm sure Spain can offer that in bucketloads most of the time compared to the UK.  It's" Horses for Courses" though.  Give me peace of mind in a fair justice system any day over sunshine.

If you shut your mind off to the problems of any country you choose to live in and  live in a bubble, then you can live in ignorant bliss.

Tish

very true. There's none so blind.........

Quote Tish: 'Spain has 20% unemployment.  For young people/families wanting a better life than they think the UK can offer, surely Spain is not an option'.

Don't forget this means that 80% are employed.  So surely any reasonable intelligent, keen enthusastic person should be capable of finding a job if they are motivated enough (Language barriers accepted).

Don't forget this means that 80% are employed.  So surely any reasonable intelligent, keen enthusastic person should be capable of finding a job if they are motivated enough (Language barriers accepted).

You've clearly never been unemployed, especially in a foreign country.  Your statement doesn't warrant an intelligent response. Sorry!

Dear All,

unfortunately all the bravado in the world will not keep anyone in Spain or anywhere else when the money runs out and starvation looms, you will of course trek to where the food is.

I am entertained and amused by the born again pioneers roughing it in the wild with wine on the sun soaked terrace and a huddle around the log fire when the sun goes in. They will be living off the land next.

every day I leave my comfortable centrally heated home (when I can afford the cost) and drive to "work" dodging the 60 mph cars on the 20 mph country lanes to get to the "farm" plough through the mud and get on with my duties as weather permits. Sometimes it does not and I hide inside a ex-shipping container and do indoor jobs at the bench (mending brooms etc.).

I do this because I am not allowed to build anywhere near where I work, not even a barn of any consequence. Thanks to the insane and corrupt Planning Laws as applied by the vested interest officials whose salary I pay (Goodstitch please note).

When cold I light my log fire fitted inside the container with true pioneering spirit.

Today we also have sun, nice and bright but not in clear blue skies and we will need many weeks of it to dry out the mud.

Hey ho.

Regards

Norman

Totally agree with both Tish's comments. And to try and spin 20% unemployment into a positive is a spin worthy of Alistair Campbell!

Hi TP1

Don't forget this means that 80% are employed.  So surely any reasonable intelligent, keen enthusastic person should be capable of finding a job if they are motivated enough (Language barriers accepted).

Remember, the 20% unemployed figured is just an average for the whole of Spain.  In Malaga province, which is one of the areas with the highest concentration of expats, the unemployment rate is actually around 40%. 

I would consider myself to be reasonably intelligent with a good CV, but there are absolotely no jobs on the Costa del Sol, especially for my area of expertise (IT).  The only jobs there seems to be down here is a few Sales jobs, and jobs for girls who want to work in Saunas. 

Gibraltar on the other hand, has quite a few skilled jobs available for people with finance and IT skills.  Northern Spain (Madrid, Barcelona, Basque country) also still has plenty of IT jobs with decent salaries.  Thankfully I'm not burdened with owning a property on the costa del sol, so I'm not tied here.  If things get really bad down here, I can be gone within 24 hours and head to where the jobs are in Spain.  The only thing I'd lose is my 550 rental deposit, which I can live with.

Hi Sanchez1,

Good luck if you find the need to move.  I sympathize with what you are saying.

I don't doubt that it is dfficult to find a job in Spain at the moment. Especially if it is not your first language as is the case for most on this forum.  lol Poppyseed 'Spin worthy of Alistair Cambell' omg on par with him!!! I gonna shoot myself

I am very sorry if my previous comments strike a raw nerve with some people.  It is merely that whilst having a discussion with my better half as to the merits of moving the kids to Spain she too was worried about the high unemployment.  I merely expressed that (in my humble opinion) our Children should be able to secure reasonable employment in the long term providing they become fluent in spanish and pass their exams, so this was not reason enough to not venture to Spain.   My point was that we personally shouldn't dismiss Spain on the unemployment figures alone as obviously there are jobs in Spain, and unemployment was not a forgone conclusion as my other half was assuming and we should also consider the benefits of living in Spain too.

 I would rather support the kids (if needbe) in the Sun rather than the rain.  Unfortunately my other half is still sitting on the fence on that one (meanwhile i freeze to death  and stick pins in my collection of Vodoo dolls of Alistair Campell and his croonies ).

 When i first came here in the boom were easy to come by, you could walk out of one into another...

Now the opposite is true,even having a command of the language doesn't secure you a position,for every job advertised there are at least 200 hundred applicants.

Although from my experience you do have trawl through many un qualified applicants to find someone qualified.

I have had the fortune to work for myself since 1999,thus keeping my destiny within my own sweaty palm.

My wife has a fully contracted job working for a Spanish company although the way things are there is no such thing as job security.

Although things are hard most of the people i know or speak to will only return to their native shores when all other options have been exhausted,especially if they have children,i think the reason most families move here is for their children,most retirees move here for the climate and freedom.

Some forum users posts on here (when deciphered) sound like newspaper articles,they are basing experience on second hand Chinese whispers, the weather  is one reason to live here as again this year we were on the beach both Christmas Day and Boxing Day in about 18 degrees of sunshine but......if i had a top 10 of reasons to be here the weather would be about 5 or 6.

For any family looking to move here at the moment the answer is DON'T, unless you have a stack of money that will last you at least 2 years.

Spain is hard work.....the reasons being.....

The language.....you must have a grasp of it to survive here and not show your ignorance.

The schooling......although class sizes are smaller (average size of 13 in my daughters school) the teaching methods are completely different,you will be expected to help them with homework and somethings, for example Maths is taught completely different, I had to approach my daughters teacher and ask her why she was getting confused....basically i was teaching her dufferently to the school.

On the up side my daughter is more or less fluent in 4 languages at 7.

Work.....if you do manage to gain employment for a Spanish company you will have the siesta and working untill sometimes 10 at night to contend with.....

Taxes.....a complete Mystery!!!

Cultural differences.......no please or thank you here or queueing and everything shuts at 2pm.

Spanish drivers......no indicators needed or used...ever and dont ask about roundabouts??!!!

3mb broadband at a push.......

No benefits system.

No religous friction.....( comply or leave)

Smoking.......pretty much everywhere.

The villages.......dont expect to drive up any road without getting stuck behind an elderly lady walking in the middle or as i saw yesterday....a woman taking a goat and a pig for a walk (called claudia).......

I work in a village where up untill a few years ago i swear they had never met a Brit!! everyone speaks,everyone knows everybody and if the mayor did anything to upset the matriachs of the village he would know about it instantly.....Kids can play in the plaza untill midnight with the parents giving the occasional glance up now and again...there is no fear here.

So to sum up,it's hard very hard and there are people going back, mainly because they have no support network in place here or benefit system.

But when you have been here a while,your kids have grown up here,you have great friends and it feels like home then spain is not  "that bad now", not as easy as it used to be but is anything that is worth having.

It is very old fashioned,very 1970's and is more than definately NOT the UK and hopefully never will be ( as i am off when it gets like that).

So from my list some people will find negatives in my positives and vica versa, if you find more negatives please stay in the UK if not it will be a pleasure to have you here.....

I can understand why some would not want any negative comments posting on here but unfortunately the truth is the truth no matter which colour you paint it! I think it is very dangerous to encourage people to move over to Spain when the situation is so dire not to mention corrupt. The best advice I would give to anybody is 'don't sell your UK home, give all you furniture away or leave your family. Rent it out, rent one in Spain, store your furniture in the UK and if possible get a 12 months career break with your job, that way you can test the water before you fully commit'

As for families with children, I know quite a few Brits who moved over here 10 years ago + and their kids who speak perfect Spanish in their teens and early 20s cannot get work. The only work they get offered are low paid non qualified jobs with no prospects. Quite a few of the parents send their kids back to the UK to live with family or friends to find work, the knock on effect of that is the mother (usually) returns to the UK to make sure the kids are on the right track and it separates couples sometimes for good!! So think long and ahrd before you do anything permanent.

The other scenario is the couple who cannot afford to just leave their home in Spain unsold and empty and go back to UK so the husband (usually) goes back to the UK to find work and sends money home, again not a good solution.

Think long and hard and do loads of research.

Dear All,

Our friend in Benidorm is to return in March due to the loss of his partner who died October/November time.

You may recall that he described her as an athlete in Spain and an arthritic cripple in the UK, their joint pensions allowed them a careful living in Spain for most of the year.

They were picnicking on the beach in October and when packing up to return home she had a slight fall which unfortunately was serious since it shattered the socket to her artificial hip.

The ambulance service was good and she stayed in what he describes as an NHS hospital but had bed pan difficulties which led to loss of appetite for both food and liquids, resulting in her death at 79.

His single pension is insufficient to continue renting and he is to return unwillingly.

She was cremated and her ashes scattered at her favourite picnic site in the hills above Benidorm.

I suppose you could say she "loved" Spain.

Regards

Norman

Norman,

omg that is so sad .... well atleast she apears to have died in a place she loved.

I am so sorry that your friend has to return unwillingly because he is unable to maintain his lifestyle.  A double blow for him.  I hope he finds happiness back in the UK.

Hi Fergus,

I understand your unhappiness living in London.  I dread having to go back to the UK, even for a trip.

Things to remember about Spain:

- There is a Spain away from the costas where you can find very reasonably priced properties, friendly people, and a very healthy relatively crime-free lifestyle.  People really do bring vegetables to your door, and you can become part of the community.

- You must learn Spanish if you want to blend in.

- You must bring enough money to live on.  Spain has NO system for supporting foreigners who need help.  This is also true of the healthcare system.  If you are under retirement age, you will not be entitled to health care (an EHC is only valid for visitors).

- If you can work in Spain but be paid in UK (e.g. internet programming) then great.  You WILL NOT find work here at the present time or in the forseeable future.

- If you buy a property in Spain, use a solicitor that lives at least 100km away from the area in which you live.  Maria del Castro will look after you, for example.  If the property is not registered in the land regisry or the Catastro, with an accurate description then DON'T BUY IT!

- At the moment, a nearly new 4 bedroomed property on the coast will cost about 500€ pcm to rent long term.  Inland, around 250€.

- Spain is congenitally disorganized.  Get used to it - they aren't going to change!

- What have you got to lose?  Go for it.  I would recommend that you rent for 6 months during which you can decide where you want to live, and learn the wrikles of buying property in Spain.  You could even buy direct and avoid agents commission.

Good luck!

I would not move to Spain at this time at all. There are no jobs on the coast and in the big cities may be more but still not enough. This will take a long time to recover so I would just hold on. HOwever, it is a different story for retired people as they don't have to rely on a job

To TP1, when sticking your pins in Alistair Campbell please stick one in him from me, preferrably blunt, bent and rusty!!

Regards, Poppyseed

TP1

A few pins for me too.

Unemployment:  Remember that Zapatero has learnt the dark arts from Campbell / Blair / Brown and is very capable of massaging the figures.

In the areas that I know intimately, I would say the figures are the other way round.  80% unemployment - but not called that. 

The small villages inland have no employment now (building stopped, a little subsitence farming). 

If you have money, you can STILL live very cheaply if you are sensible.  Just don't expect a job.

Dear All,

here in the sunny south-east we have seen a little sun, just enough to persuade daffodils to come through and magnolias to bud.

but it is far from reliable with mostly dull, rainy, sometimes snowy, misty cold. The all consuming clammy damp mist is probably the worst for the spirit.

the winter flu has struck twice, returning very quickly and the doctor says there are quite a few strains out there, it has been debilitating.

What it is like further up North I dread to imagine.

Just a thought for those who doubt the basic attractions of Spain, finances permitting.

Regards

Norman

To put your mind at rest it's sunny up North at the mo Norman.

Now back to Spain.......... I'd be interested to know of any recent tax increases.

Hi

Iva goes up across the board in July, just what many need right now

Courtesy of Typically Spanish

The Spanish Government plans to increase some rates of IVA/VAT in July 2010, so perhaps now is a good time to outline exactly what we pay the tax on currently in Spain

The 4% rate – to be kept at 4% in July 2010
This is applied to items considered to be of basic need. It includes basic bread, frozen dough, eggs, cheese, milk, beans and fruit and vegetables.
Books, magazines and newspapers.
School material with the exception of electronic items.
Medicines for human use.
Vehicles for the disabled, wheel chairs and collective transport for the disabled.
Prosthesis and implants.
Official protection housing.

The 7% rate – to increase to 8% in July 2010
Foodstuffs in general, with the exception of those in the 4% band, soft drinks.
Animals destined for human consumption or breeding.
Items used in agricultural, farming and forestry activities, such as seeds and fertilisers.
Contact lenses and glasses.
Disabled lifts and items for the diagnosis of illnesses.
Health assistance services, social services, and dental work.
Imported artworks and antiques.
Hairdressing.
The handing over of housing, including garages and annexes.
House construction (between promoter and contractor).
Services supplied by artists and technicians.
Sports, cultural and recreational services, exhibitions and fairs.
Funeral services.
Hotel and restaurants, cleaning of streets and public gardens.
Rubbish collection.
Transport of passengers and motorway tolls.

The General Rate – now 16% to rise to 18% in July 2010
All other products, including alcoholic drinks, tobacco, animals used in bullfighting, agricultural machinery.
CD’s.
Devices for the diagnosis and monitoring of pregnancy.
Television and radio services.

Thanks TeamGB.

Any news on community (local) taxes? Have these gone up based on unrealistic valuations and if so is there anything that can be done to bring them back in line with the reality of lower sales prices, or is this an inevitable consequence of local governments stretched for cash perhaps?