Winter Fuel Allowance

 On the general topic of benefit freezes & cuts, I think that we must all realise that no one group of citizens will be exempt ,& it is only a matter of time before State Pensions are frozen (this will most likely happen shortly after a General Election once the pensioner vote has been "milked"). 

It is very hard to justify that pensioners & the disabled should be exempt from cuts, when young couples with children are being "hit" with frozen pay & housing benefits, increasing food costs, higher fuel & petrol costs, no prospects of overtime pay etc. etc. etc. 

Couples with older children are frantically trying to save to help their children with University costs, & deposit payments for house purchase ( the bank of  Mum & Dad ).

The arguement will most likely be that all groups of people should take a share of any austerity measures, & it is very difficult to argue against this..

Most on here are talking about people on £40,000 plus should not receive WFA.   How many pensioners are on £40,000 plus?   Not many I would hazard a guess and not worth the admin involved in stopping it for those people.    The majority of pensioners in the UK live on state pensions (do not forget about 30 or 40 yrs ago most women did not work and did not accumulate either a full state pension (like me), no private pension, or else they are living on a single state pension (if their husband has died) on approx. £7000 pa.     By all means stop WFA for rich folk but I bet these number in the hundreds of thousands rather than the millions as the MP's who support this measure would have you believe, which would be an admin nightmare.   As for paying it to people in Spain, by all means, we have lived there in winter and it does get very cold and why should the UK be allowed to stop it for pensioners there who have paid in all their lives when Spaniards coming to the Uk will get it even if they have not paid a penny piece in, so too will all immigrants get the full raft of benefits including child benefit for their kids back home in their own countries, all at approx. £15 per week each even if they are false documents and do not exist.    £300 pa for a married couple is peanuts compared to what the government is wasting giving billions to immigrants coming here in free benefits, housing and public services.

Why does the British government love to punish the British first every time, probably because we don't riot like the French but the day will come and very soon now as people are just about sick and tired of the austerity cuts for the very poor whilst we continue to support half the world ?

 Sorry, johnzx, but just what are these munificent benefits you would be able to claim back in UK?  You wouldn't get pension credits as you have a police pension which takes you over the limit.  You wouldn't get a free TV license as you are not 75.  OK, you would get a bus pass (for what that's worth) and free prescriptions.  The NHS wouldn't feel the brunt because it is already a deep hole and, unless everyone moved into the same catchment area, it wouldn't even register as a blip on the financial radar.

You wouldn't be entitled to automatic housing as you already have a home, albeit in Spain, so your assets would preclude going to the top of the social housing list.  You might get help with council tax but, with a government pension alongside the state pension, I very much doubt it.  

Anyone thinking of moving back to UK for the sake of €4 a week seriously needs to rethink their lives.  SWMBO, being a virtual prisoner in the house in UK due to icy roads and pavements for weeks at a time, thinks you're all daft.  

I do think this "temperature" thing is a bit of a farce.  There are many "residence based" payments throughout Europe, such as child allowance in Germany which is payable to all EU citizens who live there but stops once you leave the country.  So why can't they just make the fuel allowance residence based?  

I think it's more a "well, him around the corner gets it so why shouldn't I" mentality rather than based on actual need.  I retired at 60 but don't get any UK benefits like JSA etc because my savings preclude it.  Why should I lose out if the feckless who didn't save can get it?  (No, I don't want it, just an example of the something for nothing culture, one of the main reasons I moved out of UK).

Windows not double glazed?  Replace them.  In UK I paid around £8,000 to have them all done, in Spain it wasn't even half that.  No carpets? Go out and buy some, even council houses in UK don't provide carpets.  Not insulated properly?  Don't buy a holiday home for all year round living.  The Spanish in the cold parts (and there are plenty) have well insulated housing.  No central heating?  Get it fitted if you really think it's necessary.  That the "winter" allowance is being used to subsidise the aircon in the summer and the pool maintenance is a bit of a joke.

Wodger

An how much exactly do the millionaires (on the front bench of Government, and others) reckon is their share of the austerity? Perhaps they might consider foregoing the £100000 tax relief they will be getting this year! 

 Just a thought,if WFA is to be stopped for pensioners in Spain. When UK pensioners holiday abroad should their WFA be stoped for their time away from the UK? Benidorm for example surrvives the lean winter month because of long stay pensioners who I assume are still rceiving WFA..

The fact is we should get MORE in Spain because electricity is taxed at 21 per cent IVA. I think the VAT rate for domestic electricity in the UK is 5 per cent. The point is that one governemnt or the other gets it all back in the end anyway, and the more the energy companies ramp up the prices, and the colder the winters, the more revenue pours into the treasury.

As for temperatures, everyone knows that it's how cold you feel that's important - not the thermometer reading and people become acclimatised when they've lived here a while. You only have to look at the tourists just off the plane in their shorts and T-shirts while the expats and the Spanish are in their woolly jumpers!

 This is now a really broad discussion, but I have to say again, MOST people in the UK do not have to claim for WFA.   That is why it is so expensive.  If it was  a claim system, a lot of people would no bother.   And I promise you, there are a lot of pensioners on 40000 or over.  I personally would consider that a minimum for retirement anywhere.

 I live in the mountanous region of Andalucia and I can tell you that it gets very cold here, especially inside my house which obviously has been built to resist the intense heat of the summer months.  I have had to buy a portable gas heater to withstand the cold in the winter and therefore I have to purchase several bottles of gas.  Also electricity is quite expensive here and in the winter months I have to have my heated underblanket on for a few hours every night.  I am living out here, renting, on my pension and so am very grateful for the wfa - would probably not manage a winter here without it!

For God`s sake Cameron take the bloody WFA, and stop all these mealy mouthed people  getting at each others throats, I have never known a race like the Brits, give it to all the newcomers to Englands shores who have never paid a penny into the System, yes I am an Ex-pat living in Spain recieving the WFA, believe it or not, there are some ex-pats living in Spain existing only on a British Pension , but then they made their own bed let them lay in it, eh ? so much for compassion, and as somebody who lives near Mazarron, dont let your Friends,  tell you they were on the Beach on Christmas Day without also telling you what they were wearing ? some people do like to boast about living here you know, green eyed monster and all that , dont let them fool you, and yes , Spain`s average Temperatures are higher than England,  but I can tell you ,you would sooner be in an English built house than mine, when its cold, and I will make an offer to all you doubters , swap with me for two months in the winter, but bring your winter clothes, dont believe all the nonsense you hear , or want to hear, any takers ? in the meantime I will willingly give back all my WFA paid, if that yardstick is applied to all WFA recievers, i.e. means tested, any takers on that also ? so stop trying to cut each others throats and concentrate on  more serious issue`s in the home land, probably in your ,City, Town, Vilage, Street, concentrate your energys on these issues,

Regards ,an Irate Ex-Pat fed up to the teeth with listening to it all !!!

 Being a latecomer to this all I have to say is someone ought to challenge the decission as previously mentioned.

What with this, a percentage chare on prescriptions, which if like me you need several medicines a day, despite the UK Government (?) paying back in full.

Plus the loss in spending power due to the weak £ against the € and inflation similar here to UK.

Those wealthy or well off who decided not to move full time can come and stay in thier villas/apartments, or rented accomodation and hotels, for the winter still get it, plus bus passes, completely free prescriptions, you name it.

Give it to us who if like me you paid in until 65, rather than those who get off a plane or boat and are givien whatever they want worst of all FULL health treatment, despite not having contributed a penny.

Lets face it this lot won't be in power when this kicks in but Milliband and his fellow millionairs won't rpeal it, as for UKIP, well who knows, they don't that's for sure.

Perhaps if we all packed up and went back and claimed what is or right, then they would realise we are already saving them a fortune by not being there! 

Whilst I do agree with you fighter on many points raised.  The problem is when implementing welfare changes the cost is often prohibitively too high.  I was reading that France, Spain, Malta, Gibraltar, Cyprus, Greece and Portugal residents will not be receiving these payments, whilst Sicily will!  But ex pats living in places such as Kenya, India etc will still be in receipt of these payments.  There is an attitude in the UK which has existed here in the UK for many years and has become more endemic.  The disparity between the wealthy and the poor is widening and the 10% rich fat cats are getting fatter whilst the rest are losing weight.  The transparency of news via our media now of course makes this crystal clear and people are generally unsatisfied with the state of the economy and the way things are being run, not just in the UK but throughout the world.  And I think this is a major cause for a vast change in peoples attitude and therefore taking what they can get with entitlement.  I am not condoning this practice, merely observing changes throughout the world and how governments, bankers etc have been behaving, thus causing the man on the street to be more selfish.  Still no worries we shall all be working till we're 80 or so and won't need WFA.

 Marcbernard

Yes, you are no doubt right that millionares will not want to pay any more than they are already doing, this rule applies to us all.

They may argue that they have worked extreamly hard 24/7 to secure their wealth, whilst other benefit types have spent the last 30 years sitting on their bums at home drawing the dole.

I.M.O. the only fair way is that everyone should share austerity cuts, but not equally of course. It should be based on ability to pay, & must include pensioners & the disabled. 

Oh btw I forgot to mention.  The grey vote is on the up here in the UK, so more power to the boomers,  making the Tories most vulnerable to anger from the grey vote.  I was speaking to a friend in government the other day and he said this vote is massively important and for this reason they have to tred very carefully with the voting population in the UK over 65.  I believe there are many pensioners who rely on £200/£300 each year to help towards the rising costs in utilities, and they deserve it.