Driving a Spanish Registered car in the UK

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23 Aug 2012 5:00 PM by El alamillo Star rating in Nottingham & El Alam.... 221 posts Send private message

 

I live most of my time in the UK

I own my Vehicle in Spain.

It is Matriculated to my address in Spain

Road Tax Paid to my region in Spain

Fully Comprehensive insured.

ITV up to date.

I am a non Resident of Spain.

I have access to Green Card

Which as I understand covers me 3rd Party

To drive through other EU countries.

Uk

I own my Vehicle in UK

It is Registered at my address in UK

Road Tax Paid

Fully Comprehensive insured.

MOT up to date.

I am Resident of UK

I have access to Green Card

Which as I understand covers me 3rd Party

To drive through other EU countries.

 

So why OH! Why can I not drive my Spanish car over to the UK and in UK

When I can Drive my UK car to Spain instead of flying over and use it for upto 180 days as long as all the above are in Place.

What about British servicemen based in Germany?. BFG no longer Law

They own and Drive with German Plates even on leave in UK

Yes. I know we are not talking British in Germany.

 

I am allowed one thickO! post per week this could be the one.

This is turning out to be one big roundabout said Zeberdey.

Looking forward to Replies.

Just Found this one

You can drive it for a maximum of one year, after that you would have to register the car in the UK and pay import duty and VAT on it. While driving a Spanish registered car in the UK it must display an E plate unless this is combined with the registration plate. You must be in possession of a valid EU driving licence, a valid certificate of insurance ant test certificate that is required in Spain and the registration document for the vehicle.

 

26 years as a police officer

 

 


This message was last edited by El alamillo on 23/08/2012.

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23 Aug 2012 5:18 PM by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5242 posts Send private message

So why OH! Why can I not drive my Spanish car over to the UK and in UK   Because UK laws says you cannot.   Speak to your MP if you wanna change the law.   I can drive my Spanish car to UK and use it there,  as I am resident in Spain.
 
When I can Drive my UK car to Spain instead of flying over and use it for upto 180 days as long as all the above are in Place. That's the Spanish law,  you not resident in Spain
 
What about British servicemen based in Germany?. BFG no longer Law. This is a place where people can seek advice on matters which concern them.   British serviceman I am sure can get any advice they need from military sources. 





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23 Aug 2012 5:22 PM by El alamillo Star rating in Nottingham & El Alam.... 221 posts Send private message

 Thank you John 

Just Found this one.

You can drive it for a maximum of one year, after that you would have to register the car in the UK and pay import duty and VAT on it. While driving a Spanish registered car in the UK it must display an E plate unless this is combined with the registration plate. You must be in possession of a valid EU driving licence, a valid certificate of insurance ant test certificate that is required in Spain and the registration document for the vehicle.

 

26 years as a police officer



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23 Aug 2012 5:36 PM by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5242 posts Send private message

 

That applies to a person who has gone to UK to take up residence there.  Not to a person who is resident in UK
 
(not that it matters, but 30 years as a UK police officer)

 

 


This message was last edited by johnzx on 23/08/2012.



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23 Aug 2012 6:25 PM by potblack Star rating in Alicante & Singapore. 233 posts Send private message

potblack´s avatar

johnzx I have the greatest respect for your wisdom and knowledge. But on this subject I think you ‘’could’’ be wrong on both questions. It is only my opinion.

The answer to both questions (or lack of) from the British Government departments is a smoke screen on  questions and policy they are not prepared to be up front about.

I believe that it is HMRC that is behind both subjects.

UK resident driving a Spanish car or any other non UK  (EU car) in the UK.

1.       The person driving has a valid licence under UK law.

2.       The car is legal and taxed up to date from the country origin.

3.       The car is insured within the UK environment.

So what possible crime can be committed? Other than HMRC are not getting RFL tax and sales tax on the original sale of the vehicle.

It’s all a smoke screen to deter UK residents from legally driving non UK cars.

UK resident or not.

Another complete smoke screen. So you are on the Spanish Foreign register, but you still have a garden shed in your sisters back garden. Be careful, HMRC might rule you are still UK resident. So who else decides if you are UK resident or not?.

1.2 An introduction to residence

The terms ‘residence’ and ‘ordinary residence’ are not defined in the Taxes Acts. Our guidance on these terms is largely based on rulings of the Courts. This guidance tells you the main factors to take into account when deciding your residence and ordinary residence status. Your status is determined by the facts of your particular case. It is not simply a question of the number of days you spend in the country.

Recently HMRC simplified this matter by publishing an 86 page document on whether you were UK resident or not.  About as clear as mud. It’s on the internet HMRC6 but I could not get the link, DNS server error.

 



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NARCISSISTIC PERSONALITY DISORDER: A mental disorder in which people have an inflated sense of their own importance, a deep need for admiration and a lack of empathy for others.



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23 Aug 2012 6:32 PM by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5242 posts Send private message

Potblack, 

                       Sorry you are getting confused with residence and domicile.  Having ties with UK relates to domicile.

 

Have a look at the Double Taxation Agreement between Spain and UK.  That is quite specific.

To save you searching : 

                             http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/dtmanual/dt17550+.htm

 

Re. illegally driving a vehicle in UK; 
 
 Have a look at ;-
 
 
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/BuyingAndSellingAVehicle/ImportingAndExportingAVehicle/DG_10014623

 

 


This message was last edited by johnzx on 23/08/2012.



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23 Aug 2012 8:29 PM by cazntony Star rating in Newark, UK and Mora .... 19 posts Send private message

cazntony´s avatar

 I am resient in Spain and own a Spanish registered vehicle.

I am planning to visit the UK and understand that this is OK.

My worry is that my driving licence is still registered at my old Uk address.

After just about managing all the other relevent paperwork required to become resident i have not got round to changing to Spanish and to be honest was not going to do so yet anyway.

I wonder how the UK police would view this.

Caz





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23 Aug 2012 8:31 PM by Poppyseed Star rating. 897 posts Send private message

Well despite all he hot air blowing around here I still think it's to do with potential import duty avoidance.



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23 Aug 2012 8:47 PM by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5242 posts Send private message

Caz this might help.


It's a reply from DVLA

 

 

Thank you for your email received on 18/1/10. Your email reference number is 216845.
 
Drivers who take up residence in another EC/EEA country no longer have to exchange their driving licence, but may continue to drive using their own national licence for as long as it remains valid. They should however check with the appropriate driving licence authorities where they resident for information on any conditions that the host member state may stipulate.
 
National licences may only carry an address from the country which issued that licence. We are therefore unable to re-issue a British licence with a foreign address. It is accepted that drivers who move to another part of the EC/EEA could be holding licences showing an incorrect address.

This is permissible under the the terms of the EC Directive on Driving Licence.
 
 
 
 
 
 
Regards
Mrs L Salter
Customer Enquiries Group
DVLA
 

 

 


This message was last edited by johnzx on 23/08/2012.



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23 Aug 2012 8:55 PM by cazntony Star rating in Newark, UK and Mora .... 19 posts Send private message

cazntony´s avatar

 Thanks Johnzx

That is helpful to know.

Caz





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23 Aug 2012 9:11 PM by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5242 posts Send private message

Enjoy your trip Caz





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23 Aug 2012 11:57 PM by K 5ive Star rating in Cambrils. 116 posts Send private message

So what about my RHD Land Rover that came from england, I did the decent thing and officially imported it over here and then drove it back to the UK recently for a holiday on Spanish plates as did many other with RHD spanish registered vehicles on the ferry. I also got stopped coming off the ferry by the Police once through customs and was asked how long I had owned the vehicle, I told them and nothing more was said. I was just waved on through to Plymouth.





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24 Aug 2012 7:09 AM by potblack Star rating in Alicante & Singapore. 233 posts Send private message

potblack´s avatar

Yes johnzx I tend to agree with you, but there are more loopholes than you can shake a stick to in this particular scenario. For average Joe Brit who only ever resides in the UK it is pretty straight forward.

 

What proof is needed to prove you are working outside the UK? Re. Self employed ‘’Easyjet’’ pool cleaner?

How do you define a company car? Re ''Pedro & Pedro Ltd'' on the log book?

Go away Plod, I’m innocent, I have a Spanish Padron and NIE documents, here have a look. (Even if I am not on the foreign register) which I won’t mention because you won't have a clue what that is anyway.

Plus what about the post re Daily Telegraph. Not sure what to make of that.



_______________________
NARCISSISTIC PERSONALITY DISORDER: A mental disorder in which people have an inflated sense of their own importance, a deep need for admiration and a lack of empathy for others.



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24 Aug 2012 8:34 AM by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5242 posts Send private message

Potblack, I think you are jousting at shadows.

There is no reason not to assume the system works, K 5 explained that. Although some may like to believe that all police everywhere are stupid, that is not often the case.

I accept there will always be a few people who do not fall within the precise category of being resident in a certain country, but for the majority there are no problems. We know where we live.

I recently assisted a guy who fell between the requirements when he applied for EU Registration. After explaining the problem to the officer in charge at the documentation section of the National Police Comisaria, where I am a volunteer, discretion was exercised and the problem was overcome
.
I think I have made enough posts on this thread so, unless something new comes up, I will leave it at that.

Have good day all.





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25 Aug 2012 1:33 AM by robertt8696 Star rating in Midlands, UK. 479 posts Send private message

 this is fun isnt it? the law needs to be broken down to its basic statements before you can make a decision on the original question. The first requirement is you need to determine which country you would be deemed as being a permanent resident of, and weather you can prove it. This is why the EU directive states that you should reregister your vehicle if you live in a country with your foreign registered car for more than 6 months and no longer than 12. note the word "live", this is your country of residence, and you should align your documentation to reflect this.

Secondly there is an international reciprocal agreement relating to the use  of a foreign vehicle in another countries principality which goes as follows, "any vehicle being used in another territory may be used by its OWNER subject to the legal requirements of that vehicle being complied with" This is why when you drive abroad within the EU the regulation is that you carry your owners document with you, to prove ownership and country of PRINCIPAL operation. The only exception i know of is that of a tourist hiring a car in the country they are visiting. The agreement came into being before the EEC ever was in existence.

Therefore if your RESIDENCE is determined as SPAIN, you can only drive a SPANISH vehicle in ENGLAND , or a English hire car.

If your RESIDENCE is determined as ENGLAND, you may only drive an ENGLISH vehicle in SPAIN, or a Spanish hire car.

The only possible scenario i see around this is if you maintain residence in two countries, and then you would be ok with a car in either country, but as most Expats have abandoned England.........and never register in Spain.............





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25 Aug 2012 5:30 AM by theequaliser Star rating in Spain. 26 posts Send private message

theequaliser´s avatar

It would appear that this piece of legislation is being ignored and broken by most British Citizens, probably in innocence. Why is that?

Because it appears the UK port authorities (Police and Customs), who must be fully aware of this legislation, are turning a complete blind eye towards it.

Why is it not a case of:-

Plymouth port. Umm LHD car. Good morning sir, where is your car registered?. Oh Spain. OK sir, where are you resident? Oh UK. Sorry sir, end of journey.

It all seems a farce and a case of don’t ask, don’t want to know. Why I have no idea.

impouded car

 

Never happens as far as I  am aware. But if someone knows different, lets be hearing about it?

 


This message was last edited by theequaliser on 25/08/2012.


This message was last edited by theequaliser on 25/08/2012.

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25 Aug 2012 9:31 AM by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5242 posts Send private message

Three .......

QUOTE Never happens as far as I  am aware. But if someone knows different, lets be hearing about it?

 

May I suggest you take a look at the post on 24th  by K 5  who said,  Quote:   I also got stopped coming off the ferry by the Police once through customs and was asked how long I had owned the vehicle, I told them and nothing more was said. I was just waved on through to Plymouth.

What is the point of people going to the trouble of making posts to conmtto our knowledge, if other don't make the effort to read them before posting ?





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25 Aug 2012 10:47 AM by theequaliser Star rating in Spain. 26 posts Send private message

theequaliser´s avatar

Not sure what you are on about here Johnzx. You being an ex British policeman, does this behaviour make you feel uncomfortable?.



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25 Aug 2012 11:50 AM by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5242 posts Send private message

Eye on Spain is intended to be an informative, helpful and pleasant place for property buyers, owners, expats and anyone with an interest in Spain to post questions and information relating to all things Spain.

We like to keep the forums friendly at all times and we will delete any messages which we feel are unncessary or could cause offence to other members.





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25 Aug 2012 12:49 PM by theequaliser Star rating in Spain. 26 posts Send private message

theequaliser´s avatar

we will delete any messages which we feel are unncessary  unnecessary or could cause offence to other members.

Well I completely agree. I presume ‘’we’’ includes yourself?

Nothing of offence has been posted by me. Just because the truth of this subject is being disclosed, and that includes British police officers blatantly ignoring UK laws. Consequently  it is unfortunate if you personally feel offended by the this fact, which seems to be the case here.



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Common sense is not so common.



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