paying non resident tax

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09 Nov 2010 00:00 by flyingcat Star rating in London/Mojacar. 85 posts Send private message

flyingcat´s avatar

I know this topic has been covered before, but we really need a 'guide for paying non residential tax for dummy'. We have paid tax last year through our lawyer. The fee we paid lawyer was higher than the tax itself.

After tax been paid our lawyer gave us two copies of filled form 210 (one for me and one for my husband). Each with a sticker and bank's chop on them. I understand it is not the tax certificate. The form show Huercal Overa as the adminstration office even though our property is in Mojacar, Almeria.

Can anyone PLEASE give us a dummy step-by-step guide how we can pay tax this year by ourselves, if possible, paying online since we do not plan to be in Spain before end of this year. I am sure we can fill form 210 ourselves just by copying last year's.

Many thanks.

 





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10 Nov 2010 15:09 by Tamsin Star rating. 170 posts Send private message

I would be interested in how much you paid your lawyer .  Our lawyer is quoting 200 Euors per year which we thought was too much so have declined so far .

Can anyone else tell me how much their lawyer has charged for this service .

Thanks

 





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10 Nov 2010 16:49 by Jimbofinn Star rating in Calasparra. 188 posts Send private message

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We use the company (URL below) and they charge just under £20.00 - yes twenty pounds for doing non residence tax and they are efficient and will explain things to you if you are unsure of what to do...  Their fees are per property and not per person.  Unfortunately we won't be able to use them after this year as we are now official residents.  Telephone them here:

0800 0845 210

www.spanishtaxforms.co.uk

 



This message was last edited by Jimbofinn on 10/11/2010.

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10 Nov 2010 18:36 by Faro Star rating in London. 1139 posts Send private message

Tasmin

It's unlikely you will find a lawyer doing it for less than EUR150.

For most it's not very cost effective so if they do it they look for a higher fee.

But there are many cheaper alternatives to using your lawyer.

It's actually a very easy tax return to complete.





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10 Nov 2010 22:03 by lindaw164 Star rating in Glasgow and Jardins .... 252 posts Send private message

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 If you already have a copy of your previous year's tax return then all you have to is fill in the same bits as before.  The only thing which may have changed is the cadestral value which you will find on your "council tax bill" then it is just a case of doing the calculations.  You could look at the following website which shows how to fill in the form. 

www.mijas-digital.es/.../Form%20210%20instrucciones%20en%20aleman.pdf

 





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11 Nov 2010 08:57 by leswill Star rating. 120 posts Send private message

Flyingcat, you can only submit your tax return online if you have obtained digital certification.  Have a look at our website, £50 for both forms on a jointly owned property and we also obtain the labels to attach to the form.  We can also complete a  form to notify the tax office you are submitting your own returns rather than using a solicitor  (just £5 one off fee for this form). 



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11 Nov 2010 13:12 by Jimbofinn Star rating in Calasparra. 188 posts Send private message

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I reiterate my earlier post.  You can't beat that for value or efficiency - less than 10 days for them to process our forms and get them back out to us in Spain for us to take to the bank.



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11 Nov 2010 17:37 by Dene Star rating. 23 posts Send private message

This link should assist you.

http://www.inmalagatoday.com/pdf/instructions210english.pdf

You can do it online, however you do need to get a certificate downloaded to your computer but you have to go to Spain to have it validated or visit a Spanish Consulate.

It is very easy to do online once set up. I have done mine for the last two years

Dene





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11 Nov 2010 19:11 by Joe1949 Star rating in Manchester. 62 posts Send private message

 Call me reckless but I don't tend to pay for things that I am not asked for. I have yet to pay wealth tax or La Renta .

The lawyer who did my spanish wills said if i sell up they will just hang on to the 5% retention sum that the vendor keeps to pay unpaid taxes,IBI etc..

As this one day could exceed the 5% I am getting twitchy that I might get hammered..

 





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11 Nov 2010 21:12 by Jimbofinn Star rating in Calasparra. 188 posts Send private message

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Joe

Do you honestly believe that your solicitor is giving you sound advice?  Don't  forget that if they (they authorities) do come after you, it will be with a vengence.  Also remember that any unpaid taxes will have interest and possibly  fines attached to it + any solicitors fees that he will want to clear things up for you...  You would be better off paying any dues up to date.  Just my opinion mind you.



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12 Nov 2010 10:57 by jek Star rating. 249 posts Send private message

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Joe - if you're worried about 5%, be more worried.  The retention is now 3% and has been for a few years.  And I must admit that the same thought had occurred to me.  If the only sanction is that any tax owed plus fines and interest will be deducted from the capital gains tax refund when you sell, then it would seem worth doing the sums and if you reckon that you won't get a refund anyway, then that's a pretty strong incentive not to pay it. 





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12 Nov 2010 11:32 by Faro Star rating in London. 1139 posts Send private message

To be prefectly honest I would not lose any sleep over submitting non-resident tax returns and in truth you will be quids in if you don't especially if you are paying a lawyer fees!!!

I have yet to find one person who has been contacted by the tax authorities for not submitting non-resident tax returns. Of course those touting for business will tell you they know loads!!

When you submit a CGT return that's when they will pick up on the outstanding tax ruturns and then tell you how many you should submit and in most cases they don't even charge penalties/interest for non submission. 

Englsih people in general are too honest for their own good which is why so many have been robbed Spain.





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12 Nov 2010 15:03 by Tamsin Star rating. 170 posts Send private message

I've been out of the office for a few days so thanks for the comments.


Will go on line this week-end .

 

 





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12 Nov 2010 15:18 by Joe1949 Star rating in Manchester. 62 posts Send private message

 Thanks Faro

I guess its the injustice of these 'taxes' that get me. I have a holiday home in UK & some Spanish folks own one close by.They don't have to pay any UK income tax on 'assumed  income'..I believe this Spanish Income & welath taxation  is totally contrary to EU concepts.. 





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12 Nov 2010 18:06 by jek Star rating. 249 posts Send private message

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It would only fall foul of EU concepts if there were discrimination between Spanish nationals and nationals of other EU member states.  Which is why Brussels made Spain change the capital gains tax regime from 2007.  Prior to that, residents paid 15% and non-residents paid 35% of the taxable amount and deposited 5% of the escritura price.  Now it's 18% for residents and non-residents and a 3% deposit for non-residents.  (There is certainly an argument for saying that the 3% deposit is discriminatory).  And it's still 35% if you're non-EU.  The EU says we're all residents - of the EU.  Again, non-residents renting their Spanish property were charged income tax at the full rate but were not allowed to deduct expenses.  Residents were so allowed.  In March this year, the European Court said that's not on.  Now non-residents can offset their expenses.

The imputed income tax for non-residents is not anti-EU because Spain applies the same policy to Spanish residents with more than one property.  Second homes are taxed irrespective of the nationality of the owner or the country in which he has his main home.  Incidentally, wealth tax was zero-rated from the beginning of 2008.





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12 Nov 2010 18:17 by Faro Star rating in London. 1139 posts Send private message

Jek - what do you think of this for an argument

1. Your home is Spain is your matrimonial home

2 You own no other property outside of Spain

3 Maintain non-resident tax status

There's a fair argument there for not paying?





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12 Nov 2010 20:19 by jek Star rating. 249 posts Send private message

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I don't think you'll find the term "matrimonial home" mentioned in the Spanish tax laws that apply here.  Strictly speaking, you don't get to choose your tax-residency status either.  If you spend more than 183 days in the calendar year physically standing on Spanish soil, you are tax-resident in Spain.   But, of course, no-one's counting.  So, to that extent, you get to choose where you fill in your world-wide tax return.  But the bottom line is that, if you are non-resident, your Spanish property can't be your main or principal residence. 

Nice try though





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12 Nov 2010 22:36 by Dene Star rating. 23 posts Send private message

For those who choose not to pay your tax, good luck, that is your choice. In order for people to make an informed decision I have copied the below from a tax forum. 

Four good reasons why not to ignore Non-Resident Income Tax

The Spanish Government needs to claw in more income via taxes.

They are closing in on the many non-resident property owners who are not presenting the MANDATORY annual tax return and the residents who should pay tax in Spain on their worldwide income and do not.

The Tax Authority has linked up with the Land Registry system and now knows who owns every property.

Electric companies are now obliged to supply data to help identify which homes are continuously occupied by residents or tenants.

The consequences of non-payment

Late declaration and payment will incur a fine.

Ignorance of the law or the system is not accepted as a reason for late or non-payment.

Property and bank accounts can now be embargoed until back taxes and fines are settled in full.

Worried? Only if you do nothing and mistakenly believe the myth that you are still somehow “below the radar” or that all your tax affairs are “taken care of in my country”.





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13 Nov 2010 09:20 by Norm de Plume Star rating in North Tenerife and L.... 162 posts Send private message

I have compalined to Brussels about the imputed income tax for non-residents.  They have said it is fair as it applies equally to nationals and non-nationals.  What I did achieve was theallowance of expenses against income, which was of no benefit to me personally, although I would welcome cases of wine from those whom it has benefited.  I have also managed to get Brussels to tell the Spanish Government to look again at inheritance taxation in respect of non-residents.





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14 Nov 2010 17:50 by pkjules Star rating. 3 posts Send private message

I have downloaded modelo 210, I already have the stickers but I don't have the envelope. Will the bank accept payment without the envelope? Thanks





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