Our AGM is June 1st: How do I go about 'suggesting' we have a new President ?

Our AGM is June 1st: How do I go about 'suggesting' we have a new President ?

The current President's asked us for points for the AGM's agenda.

As a neighbour of ours recently commented ' *** is as much use as a chocolate teapot !' & we agree. We have rules that are being broken all the time &, when she's asked to do something, all we hear is 'what CAN I do ?' She says she has no authority !!!

Our President has been quite ill recently but says if she doesn't do it she worries that it won't be done as well as she's done it for the year. (In her opinion).

Recently one of the committee (a male) resigned as he said the committee meetings (rest were women in their mid to late 60's) were more about Bingo & what was happening on Eastenders & Corrie than tackling issues that were of concern.

We didn't get a communal TV system for English TV after Telmicro as she spoke with three companies who said it wasn't possible ! So, she disregarded offers of help by others who knew friends on communities who had their comunal system up & running & emailed us all to say the only way forward is to have your own dish. She arranged her dish & wasn't interested in what others wanted & said our administrator told her she didn't have to arrange English TV as long as Spanish TV was there. Many bought their own dish & we eventually succombed last month.

We are a community of 54 detached 2 & 3 bedroomed houses & only around 12 owners are residents. There are a growing number of us non residents who now are able to stay in Spain longer now we've retired. Many non residents don't bother about the community, just use their homes for their holidays & basically shut them up when they or members of their family are not there. They don't attend community meetings & as far as I know don't answer emails. The residents feel they own the community & resent intrusion by non residents.

Any thoughts ?

Hi More

Long time no speak!

Isn't the re-election of officials a standard AGM agenda item anyway?

Obviously, you need to have someone willing to put themselves forward to take on the role, which is never easy to achieve.

Why don't you contact your administrators & formally request that the election of a new president is added to the agenda.

Also, if you have contact details for other owners or you will see them before the AGM, why not try canvassing for someone to agree to stand against the existing President & hope that they get voted in.

Noreen

Hi Noreen, yes it is certainly a long time since we 'spoke'.

I know you've been very busy with your own community & you have that great new phone you access emails on so you are missing my funnies that go around my friends. (You asked me not to send those as they clogged you up, remember ?)

Nothing is 'standard' at OUR meetings (I tell you ) There are not many who go, usually the residents, of course, plus some non residents who just happen to be around at the time IF it doesn't break into their holiday too much. After the 3 hr EGM last Sept most vowed never to go to another meeting. It was a farce. We did not have votes taken although many had sent Proxy votes as one of the topics was really needing attention.  Minutes didn't materialise for many weeks & apparently, the length of time these took, meant that the meeting should've been classed as void. However, after we'd been personally to his office to ask the admin where the minutes were & he'd said he didn't manage to take any because it was too hard for him to follow the meeting with so many arguing & no one controlling it, he commented that he would need to speak with our President to see what she wanted him to do next. After more weeks we all received minutes (!!) & unbelievably, these said such & such was discussed then votes were taken & such & such was the outcome.  Needless to say we & others objected to it hugely as it was blatant lies. Nothing was done about it !!

We know one gent who is actually on the committee & he's very good around the community, spraying weedkiller on weeds that grow out of some paths & roads, checking around the pool for debris, removing leaflets from post boxes so it looks tidy etc. He looked after the keys for the recently operational post boxes though no one knew he had these as the President never notified anyone.  We found out because I saw the gent in his garden &, as we had not met personally, I introduced myself & pointed out where we lived. I just happened to mention I had noticed the post boxes were now operational (after 5 yrs !) & asked if he knew how we obtained the post box key & he said he had them. When I was chatting to one of his neighbours & friends I did comment that we needed a new President & asked if he thought *** would do it. He said the two of them had been discussing it that morning & he had asked *** if he would do it but *** hadn't answered either way. I emailed a previous President of our community yesterday asking who he thought would stand but he's away, I got his Yahoo auto response that said he couldn't access his mails till 29th April. I may email *** directly now asking if he had given it any thought.

I have every owners email address as the current President & the previous one don't seem to understand the need for bcc's & so they send cc's out !! That way we all see each others addresses. (Comes in handy at times )

If we contacted our administrator & formally requested that the election of a new president is added to the agenda then there wouldn't be many at the meeting to vote. I can see us with our current President forever at this rate. Immediately before the Sept EGM our previous President decided she wanted to step down. She had only taken it on because our first one decided, after being President for over two years & getting so much done, he wanted OUT after having threats made against him & his family over something he had tried to get achieved that certain owners objected to. She was almost as bad as the one who superseded her. However she had apparently told the committee she wanted to step down citing health problems as the reason & one of her mates said 'I'll have a bash' (I can almost hear the chat between them).

We left the UK only a few days before the EGM last Sept & certainly hadn't received an email by then about her standing down but , as soon as we arrived, some close neighbours told us the President had been telling a few that she was standing down but had said not to worry as her friend had offered to do it ! (We were gobsmacked as you can imagine although to most it doesn't appear to matter who does it as long as it isn't them). We are not online in Spain but a couple of days later neighbours who are, told us they'd had an email in saying she was standing down BUT she'd arranged her successor !!!!!!!!!!!

At the EGM, within 48 hrs of her email being sent , she told us that she had decided to step down for health reasons but P** had offered to do the job & she asked for someone to propose *am, someone's hand shot up, she asked for that to be seconded & another hand shot up, then she asked for votes & more hands shot up & she then said 'welcome *am, our NEW President !!!!!

Even busier now More!

I was elected Presidente at our AGM on 11th April. Came home last Saturday & have answered over 150 emails this week!!!!

Hope you manage to get something sorted out - it sounds like a major task!

Noreen

http://www.eyeonspain.com/spain-magazine/community-horizontal-5.aspx

Unless Estatutes say otherwise, charges of Administrator and President are for one year. So initially, id Estatutes does not say the contrary, they need to be renewed once a year. Of course, the Administrator and President can also be removed by the decission of the Community of Owners in a extraordinary meeting and just with majority vote.

If you want the Meeting to discuss the change of President ( because the year has not elapsed), you need to communicate that to him, inorder to have the item included in the agenda. The item in the agenda can include the request for owners to submitt a  candidature, and if not voluntary members turn, the ellection will be open to designate any member of the community, if not the turn system will apply.

Aha Noreen , they reeled you in finally then ?  (And why not, you are passionate & get things done).

Hola Maria Thanks for dropping by my thread.

So ..... Noreen, you say I can contact our administrator & say we want the issue of a new President bringing up for certain ( but it will be done in ANY CASE anyway, at an AGM then, says Maria). OK, thanks.

Ah, penny drops here.  We had an email from our President a while ago saying AGM was June 1st & asking for any issues to be noted to her for inclusion in the agenda so I guess we'll receive an email from her or the admin saying what's on the agenda. (Memories are coming flooding back). I suddenly recall getting the agenda for the Sept EGM  (APOLOGIES Maria, I said it was last Sept, actually it was 2007 so current President has been in office over the 12 months) & it said as the last point 'any other issues' so I emailed our President & asked her exactly what was this, saying how could we think about voting on it if we couldn't be there ? Was it then ? Ooops I shouldn't have made her see red, she told me I was sarcastic.

However, I think that, as most don't know others to vote for, it will be just left to those who actually attend. We'll still have the same President.

Ruddy communities, who'd have them ?  

Phew! Are you getting in training for the agm? I'm surprised your egm only took 3 hours. (joking ) We just had our agm - 4 owners present, meeting took 4½hrs. Yes, I can waffle too!

As Maria has pointed out, the election of president is always on the agenda for the agm. If you wish to nominate someone, you must either attend the meeting, or give your proxy to someone with specific instructions. If a simple majority present (or represented) at the meeting agree with your nomination, you'll have your new president - whether they want to be or not. But I would suggest that you check whether your nominee actually is willing to do the job first. If not, and nobody else volunteers, and the current president is willing to continue, then you're probably stuck with her for now. Is she really doing such a bad job? Do you know what a crap job it is?

The residents feel they own the community & resent intrusion by non residents.

Think very carefully about this statement, especially before airing it at the agm! Of course they don't own the community, and in fact should welcome participation and collaboration in the running of your community, and probably do appreciate owners such as yourself who are concerned about the community - but for every one of you, there's no doubt several who only ever have complaints, but never any practical suggestions on how to solve specific problems, and who never offer to lend a hand in any way at all. You said yourself that many just turn up for their holidays, expect everything to be working perfectly for them, and certainly do not want to be bothered or give up any time during their holiday. That's fine, if they're willing to pay huge fees for someone else to manage their property (as they would have to if they owned an independent property), but they pay exactly the same as those who live there all year and have to handle the day to day crap and give up sh*t loads of their free time (which is no less valuable for the fact that they live there), with little or no thanks or appreciation. So you can understand how and why a little resentment may creep in?

Obviously, I don't know you (although I feel like I do a bit) or your community, it's owners or specific issues, and so may be talking out of turn, but I hope you take my comments in the spirit they are intended. (you know me too, right?)

I do know that you are a responsible, conscientious property owner, you are certainly better informed than many, and you have said that you now spend more time in Spain - so, why not put yourself forward as a vice president or committee member? Maybe that way you could get to influence the way things go a bit more, and also demonstrate to those charged with doing the job that you're not just another complaining no-res who criticises the way they do the job, whilst never offering to do it themselves.

A couple of points about the agm:

"Any other business" is a standard item for the agenda, and means just that. Nobody knows beforehand what someone else might decide to bring up. So if you aren't at the meeting, you can't vote on something raised under this point. Spanish law, I don't think, particularly gives a damn if you can't attend. That's your problem. If you feel strongly enough about it, you'll be there.

If any member wishes to propose something, either by asking for it's inclusion on the agenda or by raising it under AOB, that will involve cost to the community and therefore necesitate a vote (e.g. communal satelite installation) I would suggest they obtain a quote for such work to bring with them to the agm, and any other information that may be relevant, so that those present have a clear idea of what they are being asked to vote on. No president is likely to appreciate members turning up to a meeting with proposals, that will result in them having to spend (unpaid) time obtaining such info - come prepared, and everybody is happy.

Minutes are supposed to be sent out within 10 days of the meeting. I have discovered in the last few days that the Spanish view of what constitutes minutes may vary somewhat from ours. I understand them to be a faithful recording of what was said and done in the meeting (even if it wasn't productive!) The minutes should inform those who did not attend, exactly what took place. According to our lovely administrator, some things can be said "privately" but not put in writing! B*llox! If that's the case, those that don't attend will never know anything & there's no real point in anyone attending. The administrator doesn't have a vested interest,  and, certainly in our case, will put the sketchiest details in the minutes, so it's best if you nominate someone (who cares) to act as secretary and take notes during the meeting, produce proper minutes afterwards and just use the admin to type them up and distribute them. I'm guessing your meetings are mainly in English? That may be why your administrator struggles to follow the arguments. Perhaps you could offer to fill this role at the agm?

Did I mention earlier that I can waffle? OK, goodnight!

Hi Roberto

Well, you know how much I appreciate your input as you've helped me understand certain points before (BTW, the gazebo was made 'legal' but, thankfully, no one else has decided to erect one, though of course we ALL could NOW. )

I have been toying with getting myself elected onto the committee (as I too can discuss Coronation Street  although Bingo isn't MY cuppa  ) but my OH's not keen as he knows I get passionate about certain things & says (he's right) that it will cause endless frustration. I've had many chats with our current President as each time we go over there's something I want to know (she rarely emails claiming if there's something all owners need to know then she will let us know BUT the trouble is, she doesn't 'inform' us  ) & me, being a very nice lady, want to say 'hola' & ask how she & her husband are, too. She lives a few doors away. I rarely get answers that I feel are correct, sadly. She says our admin is unhelpful & she is getting rid of him at the AGM & having the admin that the other communities around us have as he is exceptionally helpful.

I suggested I write a community blog/website (keeping it private for just the 54 owners to read so more could be put on it as Joe public wouldn't have access) & explained to her as best I could about how many on here do it but it fell on deaf ears. I said it could help her, take certain things off her as she feels she does far too much & gets too much criticism. She just was NOT interested. (I'll send you a PM, Rob).

With regard to our SPANISH admin not understanding the meetings held in ENGLISH you are correct (to some point). When the minutes of the EGM held 12th Sept, 2007 didn't materialise by 5th November, 2007 we went into the admin's office to enquire why. (I said in a previous post 24 Apr 2009 12:40 PM what happened at that meeting). He didn't send the minutes out until 29th January, 2009 & fabricated information such as votes were taken on two points & the outcome was *****  NO votes were taken, which surprized everyone !!! Now he might have misunderstood certain things when the meeting got heated but he isn't BLIND. He did NOT see a show of hands TWICE !!

I do realise the President's job is difficult but if 'one' takes on the job willingly especially after her friend has done it for a year then I believe 'one' needs to do it a lot better than our current one has done. Before anyone asks, NO, I would NOT like the responsibility but, in all fairness to me, I never agreed to wear the hat, our current President DID !!