ATLAS INTERNATIONAL again

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21 Dec 2007 00:00 by Fly380 Star rating in Las Filipinas, Orihu.... 253 posts Send private message

There is a rumour (all chat rooms seem to be rumours) that if ATLAS INTERNATIONAL cannot sort out the multitude of problems with TECNOLOGIA URBANISTICA re clients Escaturas etc etc they may well fold. Any comments?





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21 Dec 2007 20:18 by bobaol Star rating. 2257 posts Send private message

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OH, dear, how sad.  I'm sure they will be sorely missed.

Re TU.  I went to solicitors in Spain last week.  Apparently TU turned up at court in October and the ruling against them was that they are to provide all deeds to properties from January 2009.  No, that is not a typo.  2009.  And that's only when they have to start providing them.  I went to a different solicitor and, the upshot is, I had to go to the notary in Torrevieja and complete a Power of Attorney and the new solicitors will represent me to obtain what they called a reclamation against TU.  This will, obviously, cost me (solicitors fees etc.) but I feel happier now I am doing something positive. 





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21 Dec 2007 20:23 by Fly380 Star rating in Las Filipinas, Orihu.... 253 posts Send private message

It just goes on and on AD INFINITUM. 2009 then 2011? I can't see the problem being resolved unless the Spanish Government steps in.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



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22 Dec 2007 14:40 by Rixxy Star rating in San Pedro. 2010 posts Send private message

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Well - I hate to tell you this gem, but reading the local paper her yesterday O saw an article where 19 banks are beoing taken to task for forcing mortgagees to take out life insurance with them in order to get a mortgage. Action was started by a consumer group after several complaints and should be heard in the courts soon

Action started in 2000!!!

Yes they will fold if not economically viable to keep going!



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07 Jan 2008 12:35 by georgia Star rating in Algorfa (As seen on .... 1835 posts Send private message

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Hi Fly380,

** EDITED **

They will probably close the day before they are brought to task concerning the tecnologia debarcle.

Georgia

 


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07 Jan 2008 19:39 by Fly380 Star rating in Las Filipinas, Orihu.... 253 posts Send private message

Well the bigger they come - the harder they fall - as they say. Atlas knew exactly what was happening during their latter day deals with Technologia Urbanistica and thought they could make a quick buck out of a bad deal. The buzz is that TU isn't going to last much longer and the only reason they haven't gone already is that so many other businesses would crash with them. Time will tell - in this case a relatively short time. Don't forget all these forums feed on rumour so it's only guesswork what will really happen.



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08 Jan 2008 22:39 by rowlandsbb Star rating in Gloucestershire &Hue.... 771 posts Send private message

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Just because some of the big firms may have problems does not mean that everyone else is going out of business!!!

In a way it means that the buyers approach has now changed!

The days of the Exhibitions, cheap Inspections Trips and ' soft or should I say 'hard' sell has gone 

In 2008 there will still be many UK buyers looking to find a home in Spain...perhaps more selective and more informed........taking the same approach as they do in UK when they buy

Good for the business in the long term 

And the new planning and building regulations being imposed in Spain is good for the long term market

Would any agent now encourage any buyer to :

1 Say you must pay 3000 € now to reserve the property and fix the price [ may be more next month!!] 

2 Pay 50% deposit without a bank guarantee

3 No legal permits

4 Move in with no HC [ on builders electric& water]

The future is still bright [ if hard short term]  and no doubt some of the good big firms will adjust...dont write them off !!    



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08 Jan 2008 23:53 by coast-almeria Star rating in Mojacar. 71 posts Send private message

Couldn't agree more!

I'm really busy at the moment, with 80% of my business coming from recommendations, so I must be doing something right.

The problem with the big boys is that over the last 8 years all they've seen are euro signs before their eyes, and not really cared how they've got it, hence their customer service records.

This is now filtering through as obviously clients with bad experiences shout the loudest, and through great forums like this and others new buyers are following the advice of each other.

Customer service is key for us small boys and girls!!!!!



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01 Feb 2008 19:15 by Fly380 Star rating in Las Filipinas, Orihu.... 253 posts Send private message

OK - this takes the biscuit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Quick resumee. Came on inspection trip march 2003 and bought house on Colinas Del Lago. House never built and relocated to similar house in Jan 2004. Used Atlas lawyers, Aroca Sequier, was moved in by Atlas including the services of an ATLAS rep who took me to the bank then Tecnologia headquarters to pay over the balance of the money. When I enquired about about seeing the Notary - was told this would happen in a month. So ATLAS - supposedly big reputeable company - I believed them. 3 years later still no deeds. Reported them to Surrey Trading Standards re broken promises. They were required to give me an answer.
WELL I DON'T BELIEVE IT.
This is their answer re title deeds.

TITLE DEEDS
The solicitor who acted for you on the purchase should have insisted on being provided with the the title deeds to your property at the time of completion. We understand that title deeds were not handed over at some of the completions because the builder failed to attend, as required, before the Notary. You will appreciate that this is something that is completely outside Atlas' control. The appointment before a Notary which is required to legally complete the transaction, would have been arranged by your solicitor. Your solicitor should then have informed the builder of the date, time and venue of the appointment.
Atlas does not have a legal department, which is why it recommends you instruct a solicitor to deal with your conveyancing, as you would when buying a property in the UK. It is encumbent on your solicitor to carry out and satisfy himself that there are no issues which would prevent the absolute legal title in the property being transferred to you. Should such issues arise it is important that your solicitor brings them to your immediate attention so you can make a decision on whether to proceed.

Atlas go on to say that that they have engaged the largest law firm in Spain, Garrigues to consider what, if any legal action can be taken against the builder to obtain outstanding title deeds. etc.

I seem to remember Aroca saying they had engaged the same firm a couple of years ago.

OUTSTANDING INFRASTRUCTURE COMPLAINTS.
Prior to completion the Atlas Moving In Team need to be satisfied that the property is fit for occupation. You will appreciate that, as with any new build in this country, individual units are completed before the development as a whole is finished. Whilst Atlas will make every effort to ensure that the "development" is properly completed, it has no legal standing to take any sort of enforcement action. Your urbanisation committee is responsible for acting on your behalf to rectify any infrastructure problems and we suggest you make further contact with them to remedy this situation.

WELL WHAT A COPOUT. The lawyers I used were the ATLAS lawyers, AROCA SEIQUER and now ATLAS are trying to blame them.

I am sure there will be a few answers to this post by people in a similar situation to myself. I AM TOTALLY DISGUSTED WITH ATLAS, AROCA and I hardly need mention TECNOLOGIA URBANISTICA. Evil or Very Mad Evil or Very Mad Evil or Very Mad
I hope Trading Standards aren't hoodwinked.
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01 Feb 2008 19:22 by morerosado Star rating in Guardamar del Segura.... 6927 posts Send private message

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Hi Fly

At the bottom of your post it links to the Torre co uk forum, were you aware. (Where it says, in blue, back to top). It also links to your PM & profile on that forum.





This message was last edited by morerosado on 2/1/2008.

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01 Feb 2008 19:37 by rowlandsbb Star rating in Gloucestershire &Hue.... 771 posts Send private message

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Sorry for those involved and I hope it all ends OK

But in 2008 I hope buyers are now more aware of the procedure for buying in Spain partly because of forums like EOS  and that most buyers realise that they need to deal with professional agents 

Your lawyer makes sure that planning pemits are in place before you pay your deposit

And you get a bank [ not builders  guarantee] for the deposit you pay

You get a licence of first habitation before you complete [ habitation licence]

And when you complete you only do so if the deeds state the price you have agreed [ no black money]

And you have a decent lawyer  



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01 Feb 2008 19:43 by Fly380 Star rating in Las Filipinas, Orihu.... 253 posts Send private message

Morerosado - you are correct. There are many of us trying to nail these lieing bastards.



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01 Feb 2008 19:47 by Fly380 Star rating in Las Filipinas, Orihu.... 253 posts Send private message

I have nothing to hide unlike ATLAS, AROCA and TECNOLOGIA URBANISTICA.



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01 Feb 2008 19:49 by Fly380 Star rating in Las Filipinas, Orihu.... 253 posts Send private message

100 posts. Have I moved upmarket?



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01 Feb 2008 22:45 by morerosado Star rating in Guardamar del Segura.... 6927 posts Send private message

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04 Mar 2008 11:26 by Fly380 Star rating in Las Filipinas, Orihu.... 253 posts Send private message

The following article appeared in today's copy of The Coastrider newspaper. It is interesting as criminal acts are now being suggested.

Tecnologia homeowners dissatisfied with Atlas responses – the fight goes on
Homeowners who have taken steps to complain to Surrey Trading Standards about the role Atlas International played in selling them homes with no deeds and outstanding Tecnologia Urbanistica mortgages are dissatisfied with the responses they have received from Atlas International.
At a public meeting last week, organised by the PSOE opposition party in Orihuela, many homeowners complained that letters they had received from Atlas International contained only a bog standard response, and gave no detail except to say that Atlas International had “retained the largest law firm in Spain, Garrigues, to consider what, if any, legal action can be taken against the builder to obtain outstanding title deeds”.
Residents are also angry that Atlas International appears to be laying blame at the door of the solicitor, which in every case where there is currently an outstanding mortgage, is Aroca Seiquer, the solicitor which was recommended to homeowners by Atlas. People who bought Tecnologia homes using other solicitors have got their deeds and have no builders’ mortgage on their properties. In a letter shown to me, Atlas say: “In relation to title deeds, the solicitor who acted for you on your purchase should have insisted on being provided with the title deeds to your property at the time of completion. We understand that title deeds were not handed over at some of the completion[s] because the builder failed to attend, as required, before the Notary.
You will appreciate this is something that is completely outside Atlas’ control”. People were angered by the statement, with one resident saying: “The Atlas rep was with us because he was the one who arranged for the black money to be withdrawn on completion day. If they’re so clear about what is supposed to happen, why did the Atlas rep not stop the completion, knowing the builder was not there to sign over the deeds? It is not good enough for Atlas to say it was out of their control.”
The PSOE meeting, which was designed to pull together information on all unfinished urbanisations in Orihuela Costa, was mainly attended by Tecnologia homeowners, and many travelled to the meeting from outside the municipality. There were reports of Tecnologia urbanisations In Orihuela Costa attempting to pay their utility bills themselves to avoid further water and electricity shortages. This was a solution offered to them by Councillor Aniorte some weeks ago at a meeting at Playa Flamenca Town Hall. However, at least two urbanisations have found, that on obtaining the outstanding bills, the amounts are too high to pass onto individual homeowners, and they are now forced to wait for the next time Tecnologia inevitably fails to pay the bills, which will leave their urbanisations without basic services once again.
One couple, Tim and Pamela McMahon, own a Tecnologia home in Lo Crispin in the Algorfa municipality. They have recently discovered that Tecnologia Urbanistica has placed a whopping €209,000 mortgage on their property, the biggest mortgage I have seen to date.
Tim and Pamela are slightly different to other Tecnologia homeowners in that they made a choice to withhold their completion payment of €90,000 due to a range of problems with their new home, and the fact that the couple were told by Aroca Seiquer they wouldn’t get their deeds straight away. Time said: “I wanted to withdraw at this point but we’d come so far down the line and we feared losing the money we’d paid so far.” A contract was drawn up between the couple and the developer stating that the final payment would be made on presentation of deeds. Keys were handed over and the couple moved in. At this point, Tim and Pamela had no idea there was a mortgage on their home. They were only to discover this little detail recently at which point they decided to cease using the services of Aroca Seiquer. Tim said: “It was when an Aroca representative told us that if the worst came to the worst, the bank will do a deal and let you take over the mortgage. He even gave us a reduced mortgage figure of €70,000, but we discovered he had got us mixed up with another family in a different location with the same surname. He didn’t seem to know what he was doing. That was when we decided to get out.
The same Aroca representative encouraged us to take on a ‘private’ solicitor, and to go ahead and take our paperwork, and get our money back. It was almost as if he wanted rid of us.”
Had Tim and Pam known of the builders’ mortgage, they would not have gone ahead with the installation of a swimming pool, and landscaping of their garden, costing them in the region of €40,000. They still have the final payment for their property in the bank, waiting for the day the deeds are ready to be issued, minus the €209,000 mortgage. But Tim said: “It’ll stay in the bank until we can see evidence, through an independent solicitor and an independent Notary, that Tecnologia have cleared their debt.” Unfortunately for this couple, the amount they withheld pales into insignificance against the extraordinarily high builders’ mortgage on their home.
A meeting was held recently at Algorfa Town Hall, at which point Tim was informed that the outstanding mortgage would be something he would have to deal with personally. The Town Hall had no idea that some eight properties on the urbanisation are in the same position.
However, it would appear that Algorfa is to release bond money to finish the exterior work, together with the interior of the urbanisation of some 99 houses, in order to be able to issue certificates of habitation. This would appear to be a much better deal than has been offered at Playa Flamenca Town Hall, with Orihuela Costa residents expected to stump up the cash to finish the interior work themselves, and sue the builder for the money afterwards. However, Orihuela Costa has at least 16 Tecnologia urbanisations to sort out, whereas other municipalities appear to have been once bitten, twice shy, with only one or two Tecnologia urbanisations to contend with. This begs the question, why were so many Tecnologia homes allowed to be built in Orihuela Costa, and why is Orihuela Town Hall not able to release bond money to complete the interior of unfinished urbanisations, when Algorfa Town Hall appears to be able to?
Tim and Pamela Mc Mahon have felt isolated up until the recent PSOE meeting, where they were to discover along with others in the audience that an action group will soon be formed to take on what many now consider to be criminal activity. The group will be non-political and cross municipality boundaries with a view to taking legal action against all the companies involved in this scandal. A man stood up and said to the audience: “A criminal act has been perpetrated against all of us. It is contrary to European Law and shows a major fault line in the Spanish constitution. We need to join together and forget the politics. Stand up and fight the b*****ds.” Like so many people, Tim and Pamela told me: “Our lives are consumed with this.
Every day we have been going somewhere or doing something to try to put it right.”
Details of a new website for those homeowners involved in the Tecnologia scandal will be published in CoastRider shortly.
Rebecca Griffin





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04 Mar 2008 11:34 by morerosado Star rating in Guardamar del Segura.... 6927 posts Send private message

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Yes, I was reading it, Fly HERE right down the page. I also saw something else so I'm going to the thread about demolitions to post that now.

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12 Mar 2008 05:22 by tanarmurphy Star rating. 2 posts Send private message

Does anyone have any idea how to get their atlas deposit back?....i was always verbally promised that if i cancelled the purchase, all monies would be refunded inc. the deposit - but all they state is that they keep the deposit for up to 2 years until you buy another property with them - surely they cant get away with that?...would be grateful for any ideas whatsoever?

thanks





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12 Mar 2008 09:22 by georgia Star rating in Algorfa (As seen on .... 1835 posts Send private message

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Hi Tanamurphy,

Read the small print on the Reserva contract...

I think you will find that you are tied in and if you were told that you could get it back  verbally then this was someone telling "porkies"

Regards

Georgia



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23 Apr 2008 15:21 by El Jefe Star rating in Aguas Nuevas, Torrev.... 17 posts Send private message

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Hi Tanamurphy,

I know that atlas will give your money back if you purchase another`property from them, How much have you put down. ?

** EDITED - Please respect terms of posting **


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