Ban cyclists !

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14 Jun 2015 20:08 by dr who Star rating. 37 posts Send private message

I await the mountain of abuse that is coming my way but it will sail straight over my head.

Why cant cyclists go and pedal round a track somwhere and stay off the road ? A lot of the roads i use, Sabinillas to Guadiaro, Castellar to Jimena to Gaucin, are over-run by them making it impossible many times to pass. And what do they do ? They ride two, three or four deep across the lane and natter to each other ! They ride out to a cafe causing problems on the way, have their coffee and toast and then ride back causing more problems. Why cant they have their conversations at the cafe ? To me, its groups of people going out for a good natter whilst just happening to be riding a bike at the same time. Why cant you all ride in single file ? You are not on the Tour De France you know. There are plenty of signs around telling motorists to give cyclists 1.5m when passing. How can you do that when they are four deep across the road chattering away like a gaggle of old ladies ? And why dont you use the cycle paths that are provided ? The one that links Sotogrande from the school roundabout to Castellar is hardly ever used. I've lost count of the number of times i've had to sit and wait and drive 5 kph because the nattering cyclists are spread across the road while the path lays empty !

Ban them !!!





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14 Jun 2015 21:56 by windtalker Star rating. 1670 posts Send private message

Buy a bike and join in .



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14 Jun 2015 22:38 by Sue_dear Star rating in london. 24 posts Send private message

Ha ha move to South London and really feel the pain...... I have had my wing mirrors kicked, wing dented, back panel scratched and that's by the pros...... As for the Boris bike tourists they are beyond help....please don't tell me it's that bad espana lol 





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14 Jun 2015 22:40 by Sue_dear Star rating in london. 24 posts Send private message

Ps  they have no idea on red lights, pedestrian crossing, pot holes and generally etiquete......but they will say they are saving the planet..... Bless them .





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15 Jun 2015 08:16 by dr who Star rating. 37 posts Send private message

Windtalker - I have no intention of buying a bike and joining in but i will meet for the coffee and toast. The simple truth of the matter is they are a nuisance and should all perhaps think about buying an exercise bike each and staying at home. Their wives/girlfriends can bring them a coffee etc while they are "riding" there. Cyclists are a bigger danger to motorists than motorists are to cyclists.

As i said earlier, BAN THEM !!!





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15 Jun 2015 08:39 by Hephaestus Star rating in The Peak District Na.... 1237 posts Send private message

What IMHO is actually required is cycle lanes and chipped ID plates that could be traced back to the owners if they transgressed the rules of traffic lights/stop signs etc. The cycle market is huge, you've as much chance of seeing it banned as you have of seeing the end of the internet.

Now if anyone wishes to discuss the annoyance caused by selfish cell phone users, then I'm your man. wink 



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15 Jun 2015 08:41 by Rossetti Star rating in Oxford and Zurich. 125 posts Send private message

Who's having a bad day?

Ros





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15 Jun 2015 09:09 by scubamike Star rating in Murcia province . 220 posts Send private message

scubamike´s avatar

According to the N332 website of the Guardia Civil

Once a bicycle is being ridden it is classed as another vehicle, and the rider is therefore equally responsible for complying with all relevant traffic laws, including not using a mobile phone, not wearing headphones or mobile phone hands free headsets, not speeding, not riding on the pavement, and many more, including not consuming excessive alcohol before riding.





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15 Jun 2015 09:48 by dr who Star rating. 37 posts Send private message

" and the rider is therefore equally responsible for complying with all relevant traffic laws"

But do you ever see the Guardia pull the riders over when they are blocking the lanes ? No is the answer you are looking for. They weave about in the lanes, especially when they are trying to get some speed up or ride up a hill, and i have had a few near misses in the past even when i have given them plenty of space. If they all rode in single file fair enough. But as i said earlier, riding, for the majority of them, is just an excuse to have a good old chinwag while out on the road............causing mayhem for motorists.

 





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15 Jun 2015 10:01 by scollins Star rating in London. 52 posts Send private message

Dr Who, looking around where I am ( Los Alcazares) most of the cyclists are 40 plus and ( judging by the fancy bikes) are probably the local notaries, doctors, lawyers, councillors, army officers,  police officers etc etc. I think the habit of riding in a peleton is more or less accepted in most of Spain by Spanish motorists and the chances of enforcement are zero. The up side is that Spanish roads ( at least where i am) are lightly used, fairly wide and straight so I don't find them to be much of a problem.

I must declare an interest here as I cycle quite a lot in Spain however I never use urban cycle lanes  as they are never cleaned and due to the infrequent rail invariably fill up with glass, nails and other pointy things. But I do observe traffic signals ( no great burden around Mar Menor).



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15 Jun 2015 10:06 by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5241 posts Send private message

DR Who

I note you have some idea of the law concerning cyclists in Spain, i.e. allowing a minimum space of 1.5 m when passing them. Although that only applies on a road outside a town !

Cyclists are permitted to ride 2 abreast and a string of cyclists is in law to be treated by other road users as ‘one vehicle’ so if the first one crossed on a green light and then lights then change to red, all are legally permitted to cross, etc.  Albeit that could be dangerous.

Cyclists are not obliged to use cycle lanes, and as a 'serious' cyclist for over 65 years I can assure you cycle lanes on footpaths, are extremely dangerous as in many cases as pedestrians do not look. 

I have confirmed with the police in Spain that all cyclists are permitted to use the pavement.  I personally never do so as it is dangerous.  I believe the correct place for an adult cyclist is the road, and that footpaths should only be cycled on by young children, on kids bikes, being ridden at walking pace..

Whilst I sympathise with you when you have to wait to pass a cyclist, they do have as much right to use the road as you do.  I try when I am out on my bike, to wave cars passed whenever I can, even when I am going at almost the max speed permitted and the car overtaking is exceeding the limit.

As a cyclist, I can tell you that most Spanish drivers are extremely aware of cyclists and take care when passing them. Foreign plated cars and rentals are usually much less considerate.

Just in case you get the wrong impression:  I have driven cars and largish motorcycles for 59 years, so my opinions are from both sides.

If you cannot be tolerant of other road users, maybe you should stick to using your Tardis Doc !!





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15 Jun 2015 12:25 by Hephaestus Star rating in The Peak District Na.... 1237 posts Send private message

I presume that the doc will not be attending the Clasica Ciclista San Sebastion this August. cheeky



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15 Jun 2015 14:14 by dr who Star rating. 37 posts Send private message

"Cyclists are permitted to ride 2 abreast and a string of cyclists is in law to be treated by other road users as ‘one vehicle’ so if the first one crossed on a green light and then lights then change to red, all are legally permitted to cross, etc.  Albeit that could be dangerous."

I've never heard anyhting more ridiculous in all my life. How would a driver going through his green light know if they had all passed or if there was still 15 or 20 more to come. The word "carnage" springs to mind.

Also you say that they are allowed to ride 2 abreast. I regularly pass three and four abreast. Try giving them 1.5m as you pass. You'll end up in the ditch on the other side of the road.

Thank you anyway.

p.s. The roads where i drive are nearly all country roads and lanes. The good lady and i have been out for lunch and on the way back passed 6 riders, two lines of three, on the back roads around San Martin and Secadero. They were just chatting away and were oblivious to the fact that i was behind them. Try overtaking on those roads. At some spots you can just about get two cars through.

 


This message was last edited by dr who on 15/06/2015.



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15 Jun 2015 15:50 by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5241 posts Send private message

I've never heard anyhting more ridiculous in all my life

Doc,   If you had read the Spanish equivalent of the highway code,  you would have.  

And just to add to your understanding:  In Spain,   if a cyclist is involved in any vehicular accident the law state that the other vehicle is to be considered, in almost all circumstances, to have been responsible.  So Read the book and give way to the bikes.

 

NB   I did not make the law,   I just know what it says, having taken the trouble to read the Guia De Trafico. The 302 pages here might be useful:-

http://www.dgt.es/Galerias/seguridad-vial/formacion-vial/cursos-para-profesores-y-directores-de-autoescuelas/doc/XIV_Curso_24_NormasYSeniales.pdf

 


This message was last edited by johnzx on 15/06/2015.



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15 Jun 2015 16:01 by dr who Star rating. 37 posts Send private message

John, thank you for that. I have to admit to having not read the book but will also say that i have lived in Spain for many years now and have not had one single accident. And i do hope that it stays that way. BUT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If i was involved in an accident that i knew to be the fault of the cyclist, and in every near miss so far they are the ones that have been in the wrong, there is no way i would accept responsibility and would fight it all the way. And i think every decent knowledgeable person reading this would do the very same.





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15 Jun 2015 16:24 by Fartharder Star rating in Loriguilla.. 172 posts Send private message

Fartharder´s avatar

I'm a car driver and a keen cyclist, but yet it seems to me at times like I'm one of the very few who treats cyclists with respect when I'm in the car and then treats car drivers with respect when I'm on my bike. I'm sure many of the motorists that slow down and give me my 1.5 metres when passing me also have a bike, so what exactly gets into their heads when they pull on their lycra shorts and helmet absolutely baffles me. I believe that the behaviour of many cyclists put my own safety at risk by angering other road users who could easily take out their frustrations on me. I understand why people like dr who get annoyed and want cyclists banned but I also worry every time I go out on my bike that I'm going to come across someone like dr who.

A point that's been made a couple of times is the condition of cycle lanes. It's hard to notice when travelling at speed in a car but the condition of some cycle lanes is very bad. They make them but then they don't maintain them and they end up full of stones and broken glass which is why many of us don't use them.





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15 Jun 2015 16:26 by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5241 posts Send private message

Good luck Doc.

I am in my 26th year living in Spain. 

I have been knocked of my motorbike twice and my bike twice during that time.  I also had several accidents when in UK whilst on two wheels, every time the third party accepted responsibility and their insurance paid out.  All the accidents involved cars.  So far in 70 years of using the road,  I too have not had a blameworthy accident.

Fartharder,  Here here. !! 


This message was last edited by johnzx on 15/06/2015.



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15 Jun 2015 16:47 by Rossetti Star rating in Oxford and Zurich. 125 posts Send private message

looks like Dr Who should stick to the Police Box or on foot as he clearly does not understand the rules of the road in Spain. Should he really be driving without understanding the rules of the road or have an understanding of the rights of other road users.

Ross





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15 Jun 2015 17:01 by Hephaestus Star rating in The Peak District Na.... 1237 posts Send private message

Doc, me thinks that you should quit while you're behind , so on your bike mate, only metaphorically of course. wink



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15 Jun 2015 17:40 by dr who Star rating. 37 posts Send private message

Rosetti - I understand the rules of the road, its the cyclists who dont or just choose to ignore them. I am very careful when driving and respect everyone and everything whilst driving. Do you really believe that cyclists who ride three or four abreast and do so only to chat away to their mates while being totally oblivious to everything around them are doing everything right ? I do hope not but if you do i would appreciate a call every time you go on the road and i'll stay indoors. Many of them are careless at best, ignorant at worst.





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