What must you put in a furnished apartment?

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14 Mar 2020 12:18 by Anjistar Star rating. 6 posts Send private message

So I am trying to sort out my father's estate before inherting with my sisters. He had an old house with 2 small apartments rented out. Unfortunately there are two tenants coming in at this moment on a promise from him, one of whom has gone out and bought all this stuff for the apartment and now presented me with the bill. It includes items such as sheets, towels and a huge Tiger rug at great expense! I'm prepared to be a tad generous but I feel they are taking the mickey because I am not my father, and having never been a landlord, my ignorance is obvious and woeful.

What I would like to know is, with a furnished apartment, what do I legally have to supply?





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14 Mar 2020 21:21 by Mrsubby Star rating. 75 posts Send private message

Circumstances have changed, tell them it's unfurnished contract, get a proffesional contract drawn up, or they will walk all over you, start as you mean to go on, and don't be soft touch 





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15 Mar 2020 00:06 by TFiLondon Star rating in East Sussex. 11 posts Send private message

HI, I assume the property is in Spain? So to compare with the UK if you start supplying items you will be forever needing to repair or replace them. Hence in the UK most items. including white goods, even those in perfect working order, left by outgoing tenants are either gifted to an incoming tenant or simply removed, usually with the cost or removal deducted from the deposit. So I agree, have the difficult conversation now. 

 


This message was last edited by TFiLondon on 15/03/2020.



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15 Mar 2020 13:52 by DaniMenzes Star rating. 41 posts Send private message

Anjistar

Are the new arrangements a promise or a contract. In any event they may be null and void; I suggest you get advice from a Spanish trustworthy lawyer. I doubt UK law applies in Spain, so you can reject the Argos catalogue.





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15 Mar 2020 15:01 by acer Star rating. 1361 posts Send private message

In the UK, the expectation would be so that the property is reasonably habitable.  The provsion of a huge Tiger rug is not mandatory.

It sounds like they are being cheeky and you might anticipate problems with these guys in the future.  So I would think long and hard about giving them keys.

But first off - do they have a lease or anything else in writing? Or have they paid a deposit?  Of course if they have any of these you want to see it, or a receipt for the deposit.

In the absence of any of these, the very least you should do is, as suggested by Mrsubby, tell them it's to be let unfurnished.  Perhaps add that this is what your father told you (works both ways).  You really want to avoid letting furnished - you'll have an ongoing task of cleaning and replacing.  It's always best to let unfurnished - I speak from 40 years experience.

Personally, I would boot them out now and change the locks if you've already parted with keys.  You can reasonably tell them that the situation has changed.  They sound like a couple of chancers - the opportunity to do so is now.

 

 

 


This message was last edited by acer on 15/03/2020.



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15 Mar 2020 16:01 by DaniMenzes Star rating. 41 posts Send private message

‘’ Personally, I would boot them out now and change the locks if you've already parted with keys.’’ 

Oh dear Oh dear, 1,332 posts and giving illegal thug advice. Should be banned.





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15 Mar 2020 17:22 by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5239 posts Send private message

You say you are sorting things out before inheriting.    I would think until you have inherited the property you may have no legal ability to agree / sign anything

Suggest you get some professional advice 





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15 Mar 2020 18:07 by acer Star rating. 1361 posts Send private message

That's a fair point Johnzx.  Anjistar 's comment is slightly amibiguous, but I assumed that by saying "trying to sort out my father's estate" he was acting as the executor of the will, where presumably he does have the authority to act.

But there are a few uncertainties - hopefully he will clarify.





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15 Mar 2020 19:07 by Anjistar Star rating. 6 posts Send private message

Sorry for any ambiguity. Thanks for all the replies.

They don't generally have executors in Spain, the beneficiaries of the will are left to sort things out as long as it is for the benefit of the estate. That's myself and my two sisters. I get to deal with it because I speak Spanish. The lawyer who is dealing with the probate is actually writing the new rental contracts, so I am assuming he would have said if we are not allowed to do this.

None of the tenants currently have a valid contract, though two of the three have in the past, one for one year, one for about 4 years. So that's a mess. Tenancy laws in Spain are heavily weighted towards the tenant. They can basically stay for 5 years as long as they pay the rent on time. There is no paperwork! And no bank records, not that I can access his account any more.

My father made promises and we are trying to uphold them. He also allowed one tenant to start redecorating before she moved in so she had already spent money on that before my father passed away. The flat was slightly trashed by the previous tenant - not maliciously but man with two large dogs who's partner left him and he didn't cope very well. So it does need a fair amount of furniture, though not white goods. I wanted to just check that I am being reasonable not paying for anything that could not be passed on to a later tenant. I also don't want to set a precedent where I get to replace the sheets they've ripped a hole in or poured tea over every couple of months.

Just to avoid more ambiguity, I am she, not he. :)





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16 Mar 2020 12:52 by acer Star rating. 1361 posts Send private message

I've never rented out in Spain, so my knowledge is limited.  I have heard, as you say, that renting Spain is a bit of a minefield. 

But I am familiar with leases, legislation, BTLs and practice in the UK - where I also managed a couple of blocks of flats on an ex gratia basis, until retiring recently.

There was a silly comment from one quarter, but the fact is that the lease is a key document.  You must ensure that the new lease says what you want, or suffer the consequences.  You must tell the lawyer what you want and check it's correct yourself before it's released to the prospective tenant to sign.  Now is the time to be decisive and yes, I have no qualms in saying "boot them out" if you don't like their attitude.

Their previous leases will probably be considered of some indication of the intention - but you can change that now.  Of course when signed by both parties the new lease will be the only document that matters.

As I mentioned before, unfurnished is a lot simpler.  But a compromise might be to provide limited "white goods" - washing machine, fridge/freezer, cooker & hob (electric is usually simpler as a landlord).  These make sense, but avoid soft furnishings, besides the need for them to be fire safe, they tend to worse for wear far more rapidly.  You don't want to have to replace them each time with a new tenancy.

To do the job as a landlord properly requires a commitment.  If you're not careful you might give yourselves a lot more work than you might anticipate.  Are you sure you and your sisters wish to do this?   In the UK the property sector is rife with corruption - I suspect it's just as bad here.  It's something that you should think through, before you take this on board.





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16 Mar 2020 13:24 by Anjistar Star rating. 6 posts Send private message

Thanks for that, Acer

"To do the job as a landlord properly requires a commitment.  If you're not careful you might give yourselves a lot more work than you might anticipate.  Are you sure you and your sisters wish to do this?   In the UK the property sector is rife with corruption - I suspect it's just as bad here.  It's something that you should think through, before you take this on board."

We do actually want to sell the property as soon as possible after we inherit; we have no wish to be landlords of foreign property. However, at the present time, before probate, we have to work for the benefit of the estate, therefore to be legal, we should put contracts in place. But I am in discussions with the lawyer about the possibility of not letting it at all.





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16 Mar 2020 14:01 by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5239 posts Send private message

I am surprised you are talking about 'the estate.'  I did not think it existed, if if does it is very different from that concept in U.K.  For example, in U.K. inheritance taxes are paid by 'the estate' whereas in spain the inheritor is responsible, and the tax due depends not only upon that person' s relationship to the deceased but also to their personal wealth. 

 





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16 Mar 2020 16:08 by Anjistar Star rating. 6 posts Send private message

Johnzx, I', not quite sure what you mean by the first 2 sentences. I just mean my father's property and capital, what should I be calling it?

I know about the relationship thing but haven't heard that your personal wealth counts. IHT allowance in the Canary Islands is 99.9% for adult children and adopted adult children. Any other relationship has different levels of taxation. I am told we get 6 months to pay and there are options after that but they accrue interest. You have to pay before inheriting.

 





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16 Mar 2020 17:17 by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5239 posts Send private message

I believe in U.K. the assets of the estate are established then if tax is due it is paid from the assets of the estate.  The remainder is divided as set out in the Will. 

in spain the person inheriting must pay any tax due on the assets they will acquire.  As you will know the rules of inheritance vary from region to region. 

That is why I suggested you take professional advice. 





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16 Mar 2020 19:24 by Anjistar Star rating. 6 posts Send private message

Thanks, Johnzx, we do have a local lawyer and accountant on the case. However we've drifted from the original question about furnished lets so I think we'll close this thread now!

Thank you to everyone for their input, most of it was very helpful.

 





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18 Mar 2020 16:26 by mariadecastro Star rating in Algeciras (Cadiz). 9290 posts Send private message

Legal Questions? Speak to Maria Direct

There are no regulations for furnishment in long term rentals. Just touristic rentals have minimums requiremmets on furnishment and it depends on the region where property is located

M

 



_______________________

Maria L. de Castro, JD, MA

Lawyer

Director www.costaluzlawyers.es

El blog de Maria



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