Claiming job seekers allowance in Spain

Well between us we seem to have pointed you in the right direction SpanishFruitcake.

I too work in the UK but on stints of 6 weeks on 6 weeks off. I could claim in either direction but to be honest, I cant be arsed with the "Funcionario" aggro at each end. I value my sanity. I would have to P45 at the end of each period and suffer the rigmarole.

Another issue is you may have to complete a Spanish tax reurn form and engage the services of an Asesor Fiscal or Abogado even.

Have a good try 'Fruit' and I hope it works for you.

Hang on paulsimkiss, SpanishFruitCake is doing nothing wrong by claiming what is "theirs" by right. Mr. SpanishFruitCake earns his money IN the UK and no doubt pays UK tax and N.I. as I do. But we, as expats do not make full use of the facillities provided to us as we are absent from the UK for much of the time. IF they were living in the UK and he and I kept to the same routine we could cost the UK taxpayer more by claiming relief from Council Tax,  Income support etc etc. In effect doing the country a favour!

There is no moral issue here. If the system is there to use LEGALLY then use it, it's your money as you have EARNED it. The MP's obtained money ILLEGALLY and they did not EARN it!

Thanks Gazzerb :))

Hello Gazzerb

Not sure I can fully agree with you here. But I do understand what you are trying to say. Morals are always going to be a matter of opinion and will vary from person to person.

‘JSA’ what is its definition. Is it ‘Job Seekers Allowance’ meaning financial assistance whilst genuine seeking a job of employment, or is it a financial entitlement whilst being unemployed, even if you have no intension what so ever of finding a job, which certainly would be the case if you were in Spain.

Good Morals can be defined as acting within the spirit of the scheme of which it was intended. Bad Morals can be defined as milking the system because it is legal to do so.

All that about the Fruitcakes living in the UK, re council tax etc, it’s just saying two wrongs make a right.

And no, most of the MPs obtained the money legally by milking the system. Very few were prosecuted, only the extreme cases. Most just paid it back because it was morally wrong to take it in the first place.

The only way to ever find the truth about the Fruitcakes situation, is for the fruitcakes to come clean with the benifits office and get a ruling. Why ask all Spain on a forum, unless they are seeking advice on how to milk the system and dare not come clean with the benefits office. I think both you and I and the fruitcakes know what the answer might be. Also if the Fruitcakes are not sure, why take the chance of commiting benefit fraud. If they had to go to court, is there defence going to be 'Gazzerb' said on a forum what we were doing was legal, so we are not guilty of benifit fraud your Honour.

 No, I am sorry - I have remained quiet but I cannot any longer.  Gazzerb - it is exactly that kind of thinking that has led to the UK being the benefit paradise of the world.   Can you just sit and think about it?   Try working out how much you personally have actually paid into the system via your NI.   THEN set it against what you could take out just by 'legally taking what is yours'.  I think you will find that a stint on JSA will quickly eat into what you have paid, and that is before you get to the pension!!!!!!     This business about 'I have paid into the system and should get it out' is a load of tosh.  People should work out how much they have paid in over their working lives.  We would find it is considerably less than we expect to take out in the form of a pension.  So anything else should just be an emergency cover arrangement for those in dire straits.     

Gazzerb you need to be a bit more careful before opening your mouth. You may think you are the latest barstool know all. But are you going to give evidence at Fruitcakes trial, and are you going to help them pay their fine if they are found guilty of being benefit cheats and Costa Blanca’s latest scroungers on the UK benefits system. All this bad attitude about I have paid into the system, so I am having it back out stinks. It’s wrong; you and the Fruitcakes would take food out of a starving baby’s mouth for your own greedy benefit. As PS suggested you both have morals like a thief?

The fact is that the scrounging Fruitcakes should never have posted this question on here. They should have asked the benefits agency. And you Sir are not qualified to give them an opinion. Why not stick to a subject you are qualified to answer. If you did, we would probably never hear from you again.

Peeps:

SpanishFruitcake asked a simple question however it was a little ambiguous.

Was it to claim JSA from the UK whilst here, or

was it to claim Spanish unemployment here?

The Jury is still out on that one.

What I answered was intitially for claiming here in Spain, which as an E.U. citizen he is entitled to do. Whether there are jobs available or not. Governments would like that, no jobs, no claimants, result!

Then he was castigated for being an immoral person for claiming what is his of right as a UK (EU) tax payer. If he does not claim it (in either country) does that give him the higher moral ground? Forget where he lives, ask yourself what are his rights as an EU citizen? He CAN claim in either location but with limits as to duration and/or amounts.

The moral situation is IF Mr. SpanishFruitcake gives a false declaration to either Unemployment Agencies he THEN falls foul by moral obligation and commits fraud, not before.

What happens to all the "jobbing" builders in the UK when their short term contracts come to an end? Do they not go and sign on because their next job doesn't start for another 6 weeks? No, they pre-register for unemployment and get thier "dues" asap because they have earnt it. Mr.SpanishFruitcake would be no different as would I.  WE HAVE EARNT IT!

So Mr. SFC (that's better) can either visit his local UK  DWP and ask OR go to his local Spanish unemployment office and take his chances. The fact that there are "no" jobs in Spain shouldn't stop him from applying.

Bri: We still don't know where Mr.SFC wants to claim. I don't claim at all, in either location but I am entitled to but I don't have a "Holier than thou" attitude. I just can't be arsed with the formalities. I didn't make the rules for claiming from the DSS, they did. By the way, have you given your winter fuel allowance to anyone needy these last few years?

stevebatchelor:: I am qualified because I have been in this situation (on behalf of my wife) and have encountered first hand what the Spanish require of you. I have been in and out of this office, that office, round the corner, foto copy this, that, back to the Hacienda and treated just like I described to Mrs.SFC. As I mentioned to Bri. I don't claim, so my morals are intact and scrupulously clean. I merely play Devil's Advocate to promote discussion and hopefully helpful advice about a  subject I have full working experience of. No witness appearance would be necessary as I am not advocating FRAUD!  You know so little about Mr.&Mrs. SFC's situation that I think it is unfair to call them "scroungers". What do you do with your Winter Fuel Allowance?

This goes to all the other recievers of  Winter Fuel Allowance, do you pass it on to someone more needy in the UK personally? Don't not claim it otherwise it will just get lost in the DSS pot. Give it to a family that has mouths to feed and bodies to keep warm.

No I thought not. Now that IS a moral issue!

WOW ... this site is certainly entertaining.

My husband would only claim JSA whilst registering as looking for work in Spain if he was told in the UK that he is entitled to do so. simple as that.  If that makes us scoungers, so be it. 

Also Mr Gazzerb, you cannot help yourself, but come out with more barstool childish remarks over winter fuel allowances. I am not retired.

As you have just posted what was posted earlier in the thread , MrSpanish fruitcake is entitled to claim. He , nor the UK, didn't make the rules the EU court did. The original court ruling was  a German unemployed man who moved to poland looking for work & was denied his benefit .The highest EU court ruled that it is transportable.

Mr SF has only to comply withthe rules before leaving the UK & with the requirements in Spain , sign on within 7 days & then every 3 months, to comply & be in receipt. The ,money which is paid by the original country.

I prefer to see someone who is entitled to it , receiving it , rather than people who have never worked in their lives !

  And for me that is a problem.  I would rather see it only going to people who actually need it.  Not who believe that they are entitled to it, and think they should get out of the sytem what they have paid into it.  This thinking is what has led us to the verge of ruin in the UK!!

Hi Brian, I'm with you on you thinking.

Take care

He's entitled . He has paid in & is out of work .

This is the what has led the UK to the verge of ruin .

"Socialism has been the greatest failure of modern Europe, the UK included.  Post war prosperity has afforded an indulgence of thinking where perceived kindness has in fact fostered a dependence on the state that has undermined human dignity. Where is the dignity of a woman with seven children who takes money from hard working people so that her kids can have phones and game consoles while the able bodied 20-year-old son shoots pool? "

Anna Grayson . Journalist Canada free press.

I totally agree with Bri on this , which is also clear from my earlier post

** EDITED - Spam **

 I agree with Sr Lopez on this. People like Bri & wend691 are socialists who want taxpayer money to go to people "who actually need it" regardless of whether they contribute to society. In fact they don't associate money as coming from taxpayer, they think it is Government money. They like to spend other peoples money on those they perceive as "vulnerable". Unemployed single mother of six from six different fathers there is no question meetS criteria of "actually needing money". This attitude has brought Europe to its knees. I have lived uNder communism.

This fruitcake man seems to have a job in UK and contribute to society. He is quite entitled to try his luck at finding job in Spain. People who call him scrounger are arrogant and ignorant.

Seeto Kui

 That's an interesting piece of chop logic.  Let's look at some figures.  IF a person earns a flat amount for the whole of his/her working  life - let's say £50000 every year for 40 years.  (Do I have to point out that that is WAY over what most people would average in a working life), but if I did that, my total in NI would still only be around £150000.  This would be enough for about 25 years on current pension payouts, for pension payments.  Remember that you are not paying into a pot, you are contributing to the welfare state today, to support those on benefits or pensions.   I am not sure what the average salary in the UK is - but it is not very high, and therefore the NI paid is not very high either!!!!   This is what I mean when I say that you cannot expect to 'take out' of the system what you have put in, because in a lot of cases, in most cases even, taken over the life of a worker, it will be considerably less than you take out in a pension - without adding other benefits to that.   My position is simple - the benefit system is there to support those not able to look after themselves.  Not to be a 'savings bank' for those who milk the system.     Oh - and don't forget, some of the HUGE amount of money you have paid into the system in NI goes on supporting the NHS as well.  Never mind - just go on in and 'take what is yours'.   

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2096927/Mick-Jean-OShea--10m-lotto-winner-STILL-claiming-6k-year-benefits.html

Nothing to do with claiming JSA in Spain but follows the various comments re who should claim benefits, or rather who should benefits be paid to.

Ummm excuse me! I work hard and have a good job and pay a considerable amount of MY hard earned money into the system. I AM one of the taxpayers you refer to seetokui