185 Million Euros in off plan deposits lost on just five developments. Want to add yours?

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25 Jun 2011 00:00 by Rambi Star rating in Tenerife, Canary Isl.... 82 posts Send private message

In an effort to put a different spin on the problem of off plan deposits and bank guarantees. I am attempting to 'follow the money' because I feel the World’s media and Politicians will be far more shocked at the total amount of money lost, than vague figures of disgruntled buyers.

These same vague figures have been dismissed by the Spanish authorities as 'A few protesters' and in fact they are right. Compared to the millions of successful foreign buyers of Spanish property, our numbers are truly insignificant. This provides the authorities with a 'you can't please all of the people all of the time' excuse that everyone can understand. However an inspired guess amounting to Billions of Euro’s is less easy to dismiss and in my opinion will lessen the validity of this excuse.

I know that to find out how much has been lost across Spain is impossible but through researching jus five developments I've managed to get to nearly 185,000,000 €. This money seems to have disappeared between the banks and developers. Someone has to ask, where did the money go?    We all know where it came from.

It's been said to me the Spanish banks are on their knees and we will never get our money back. But should that stop us trying? Even if we fail at least we will have put up a fight. The Spanish should be reminded that the Brits have never been a push over. Fighting talk maybe, but I for one am never going to give up this fight, and I'm sure I will not stand alone.

Our most effective weapon is knowledge. Let's play to our strength. Use the knowledge we have and combine it to make a forceful, powerful weapon. We all know that money talks, so let's start talking money. How much off plan deposit cash has been lost on developments researched so far?

Liber, Costa Blanca  67,500,000 €

Trampolin Hills, Murcia  60,000,000 €  

Estoponia beach & Country Club, near Marbella. 48,500,000 €

Finca Parcs, Murcia.  6,000,000 €

Amarion lll, Costa Blanca .2,500,000  

Total lost so far 184,500,000  

One Hundred & Eighty Four Million, Five Hundred Thousand Euro’s.

A bigger prize than any Euromillions lottery win.

These figures have generally been rounded down and all figures are the best guess from information available including press reports. But there are millions more sloshing around. Remember this is only five developments. If you disagree or have other figures just contact me.

Your part in all this is if you have figures for any other developments PLEASE send them in. Obviously they are not going to be accurate and will be reported as, ‘It is estimated’...or ...‘could be as high as’. But at least it will strengthen our cause and get people talking about the money. We have to start thinking outside the box because the normal routes open to us have not, as yet produced results.

Leave me a private message on this site or write directly to me at mikejbayliss@hotmail.com

This approach does not detract  from what has already been done (petitions etc) but it might attract a high level of publicity which can only work in our favour. Many of you might think this is a fools errand, but humour me, and I'll see how far I can take this. You may be surprised, and I will feel that I'm at least doing something. What have you got to lose?

Good luck and regards.

 

 



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This message was last edited by Rambi on 25/06/2011.



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25 Jun 2011 13:09 by belucky358 Star rating in North Yorkshire. 197 posts Send private message

 


 



This message was last edited by belucky358 on 25/06/2011.



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25 Jun 2011 13:42 by belucky358 Star rating in North Yorkshire. 197 posts Send private message

Hi Rambi,

I've sent you a P.M.





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25 Jun 2011 13:53 by newworld Star rating. 939 posts Send private message

3 Molinos Resort   ? Murcia





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25 Jun 2011 14:51 by Seashells Star rating in Suffolk / Limaria. 81 posts Send private message

Huma Mediterranio in Almanzora   1.8 million approx

Huma Indelo  Tebernas    1.6 million approx

The Spanish goverment can just sit back and let their developers and banks continue to con the people of europe ( mainly the Brits ) We are doing a bail out of the Spanish debt problem and they hav;nt even asked for it yet. Long live the generosity of the British people, apparently in spain, crime does pay

A very pissed off so called purchaser who is down 54,000 euros





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25 Jun 2011 16:25 by Rambi Star rating in Tenerife, Canary Isl.... 82 posts Send private message

Thanks to you all who so far have responde to my post or have emailed me. The figures are growing and I see I have had 199 views.

Unfortunately 194 of you did not respond.  Maybe the subject did not apply to you. But If it did I do wish you would come back. I need your input and help.

PLEASE.

Regards

Rambi.

 





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25 Jun 2011 16:41 by nigela Star rating. 417 posts Send private message

 You may find some p[eople view this site and allready see their off plan developement included - Seashells got in before me with ACC.





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25 Jun 2011 16:46 by Rambi Star rating in Tenerife, Canary Isl.... 82 posts Send private message

Thanks Nigela,

I never thought of that. I trust you agreed with Seashells approx figures? I assume you do so no need to reply.

Regards

Rambi





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25 Jun 2011 17:06 by haydngj Star rating in ALGORFA. 403 posts Send private message

haydngj´s avatar

and there many who lost in the 5 developments already shown. It is a damn good idea to high light the millions lost. I was in the Aarion111 development,and have been to the courts and won. What that did was to give the lawyer 3500 euro. they're all in the same trough dinning and living off unearned income





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25 Jun 2011 17:15 by Rambi Star rating in Tenerife, Canary Isl.... 82 posts Send private message

Hi haydngj,

Thanks for your input.

Yes, I guess you are right. That is why I feel that the money will do the talking for us. Not through the Spanish but from our own politicians and madia.

Cheers

Rambi





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25 Jun 2011 17:38 by newworld Star rating. 939 posts Send private message

I know people who put money down with polaris world on a site called la loma up the road from la torre that never got built , they were taking polaris to court to try and get deposit money back.





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25 Jun 2011 18:29 by Rambi Star rating in Tenerife, Canary Isl.... 82 posts Send private message

Thanks newworld,

Have you any more details, press reports etc. It will cut down on my detective work if you have.

If not I will try and track 'em down and bring 'em in.Thanks for the tip.

Stuff coming in all the time and the figures are approaching 200,000,000 €. Some more figures have been promised to me when the owners get their details together. I want us to get over a Billion. I shall post a full list as soon as I can.

Regards,

Rambi





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25 Jun 2011 21:14 by mariadecastro Star rating in Algeciras (Cadiz). 9344 posts Send private message

Legal Questions? Speak to Maria Direct

 Keith has just launched a new press release on this.

I am confident it will make its effects and Banks will be willing to care for this people. They might be able to turn them into buyers of well-priced property in Spain and fix part of the problem this way. Better together for a solution, with acknowledgement of rights breached. This will certainly have a positive impact on Spanish economy

http://www.eyeonspain.com/blogs/ley5768/5726/press-release---spanish-government-in-denial-over-the-number-of-innocent-victims-affected-by-problems-in-the-property-sector.aspx



_______________________

Maria L. de Castro, JD, MA

Lawyer

Director www.costaluzlawyers.es

El blog de Maria



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26 Jun 2011 03:07 by Rambi Star rating in Tenerife, Canary Isl.... 82 posts Send private message

I hope you are right Maria but I fear you may be a little too optimistic.

I'm sure there are many victims of the Bank's and Developer's dishonesty and disregard for the law, not to want to even contemplate ever attempting to buy any more property in Spain, while greed and corruption can circumnavigate the legal system.

 It must make your job very difficult. 





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26 Jun 2011 03:28 by ads Star rating. 4025 posts Send private message

I also fear that "dealing" runs the risk to create a two tier system which will play into the hands of the Banks, where those unwilling to do deals will be left indefinitely awaiting recompense, as the Banks continue to deny their responsibilities according to the laws of the land.

Good luck with your endeavours Rambi.



This message was last edited by ads on 26/06/2011.



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26 Jun 2011 03:53 by Rambi Star rating in Tenerife, Canary Isl.... 82 posts Send private message

Good point ads,

The banks could plead poverty and suggest that this is the only offer they can make and by not taking it we could lose our ability to fight. I don't want a property that is probably going to be difficult to sell on. I have now made other arrangements and a new life here in Tenerife.

I want nothing more to do with buying property in Spain, at any price. I just want my money back as the law has decreed.

Thanks for your good wishes.





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26 Jun 2011 11:30 by belucky358 Star rating in North Yorkshire. 197 posts Send private message

Hi Rambi,

That's exactly right, I do not wish to have anything more to do with buying property in Spain, all I want is my hard earned money back.

I would hate to become involved in a system where you are allocated a property, any property, as compensation !!!!! 





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26 Jun 2011 17:16 by haydngj Star rating in ALGORFA. 403 posts Send private message

haydngj´s avatar

I'm one who did buy again in Spain. Having had many long holidays in Spain I took a chance on a resale property. Thankfully this went on with no problems.Having lived here in Spain for the last 4 years I have no regrets about buying again. The offplan sales are the ones to avoid, be it through U.K. agents or Spanish, they are the scum of the earth selling off plan. Would you consider buying anything else without seeing it. Oh no, but many of us did this foolish thing, buying a pig in the poke.

All the advertising was so missleading, I thought I was being clever not using the big companys Masa etc.,went with a company that had offices all over the U.K. and the Costas they were known as Palmera Properties biggest crooks of them all and all were u.k bred.

Still hoping to get my deposit back through my lawyer  Bano Leon based in Alicante and Madrid. not holding my breath though as its been 4 years now  since the lawyers took on the case





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26 Jun 2011 17:51 by nsmisa Star rating. 43 posts Send private message

I have been directed here by belucky, from another thread.

I was involved in Hacienda Casares, but got a switch to a more "upmarket" development at Estopona. However, it turns out that Aifos weren't even in a position to deliver on that site at all, as they owed money to the developer there? Total fraud and I have the court decision stating what they owe me - but that isn't worth the paper it is written on IMHO ?

We approached the Administrators with a view to taking a property off their hands, properly revalued to current market conditions, for the amount they already owe us - but they rejected that idea as it meant entering into yet another Contract, whilst existing ones are in dispute? Seemed any easy "get out of jail" option for them to me, however, they aren't interested?

As I said in the other thread, the Administrators and the lawyers will be the only other people to benefit from this farce.



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28 Jun 2011 02:15 by Rambi Star rating in Tenerife, Canary Isl.... 82 posts Send private message

THE MISSING MILLIONS

Today’s figures are now nearly 208 Million Euros with another 3 developments added this week-end

Development.

Amount in €’s

Liber, Costa Blanca

67,500,000

Trampolin Hills, Murcia

60,000,000

Estoponia Beach & country Club, Nr Marbella

48, 500,000

Finca Parcs, Murcia

   6,000,000

Amarion lll, Costa Blanca

   2,500,000

Huma Mediterranio, Almanzora

   1,800,000

Huma indela, Tabernes

   1,600,000

Santa Maria, Green Hills, Elviria

 20,000,000

TOTAL

207,900,000

 

Many thanks to all those who have supplied the information. Let us all keep up the good work. I cannot do it alone. With the exceptions of my own development (Trampolin Hills) and that of Keith Rules at Finca Parcs I had never heard of the other developments. Our success or failure is in some measure in your hands. In order to get the most out of this effort I need the input only you can give.

These figures have all been rounded down and are probably too conservative in many cases. I think some of you are reluctant to throw your hat in the ring because you do not have any hard facts. I am not necessarily looking for hard facts. I want your best guess. If you said to me “I reckon more than half of my development was sold off plan” I would put that down at 50%. If you went on to say, “I put XY down as a deposit but I could have put down the minimum required of X” I would then take the 50% figure and multiply it by X to get my result. Some may be too high while others may be too low. The result will be another figure and another development added to the list. So don’t be shy, talk to me.

In the light of no figures at all we have to go with our best guess. If the figures are challenged my reply is “let’s have your figures then”. We all know that it is impossible to get accurate numbers as no one knows. The above is as hard evidence as we can get. If there is a Spanish authority or banker who does know, they will make sure that such information is locked firmly in their vaults. They would not dare to expose the massive fraud they have perpetrated.

Give me as much information as you can and tell me if that is all you have. That will save me getting back to you to check if there is any more. If you just know the name of a development and nothing else I will attempt to track it down, if I have the time. But this can be difficult sometimes. I looked up ‘Polaris World’ on Google and discovered over three million entries.  I decided not to continue.

If this source dries up I will Google every development I can find to see if they have a forum, if they do I will appeal directly to their members. This will of course take some time, EOS has 4,500 Community threads so I’ll start at A and go from there. I will ask Justin if he could help with this.

Help me to keep up the fight and thanks for sticking with this. I still believe this will be a significant weapon in our Armoury.

Rambi.





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