Things that will affect resident brits after 31st Dec 2020

Thanks once again to everyone for futher information...
Looking at an article on thelocal dot es (eyeonspain won’t allow me to post urls) it would seem there is little necessity to apply for a TIE if you already hold the green NIE paper.

If anyone IS interested in reading the article I can only suggest googling the following text and ‘thelocal’ page comes up near the top results

Q&A: What Brits in Spain need to know about the new Brexit-friendly residency card

That's right, there's no legal obligation to do so, but a proper ID card showing your residency status is surely preferable to a flimsy piece of green paper that is of very little use? 

You started this thread by saying you have your NIE & passport. You did not make it clear whether or not you have ever registered as a foreign resident. I think you are confusing your NIE number with residency & the green paper for registered residents. (Don't mean to sound pedantic, just trying to make sure the difference is clear)

Is this green paper vs ID card a load of time wasting nonsense.

As far as I know at the moment the flimsy bit of green paper is just as valid as any so called ‘’proper’’ ID card. You do not need ID to buy a loaf of bread at the supermarket. Once your registered resident and have your Padron what use is either? My bit of paper has been in my safe for the last 12 years. But if you know better Roberto as always I would respect your knowledge.

As Brits, we are supposed to carry our passports with us as the only official form of ID (the green card specifically says it's not for ID purposes). I never do carry my passport nor a copy and have never been asked for it except at the bank on a few occasions. 

I have been asked for ID on a few occasions when buying something over 300 euro but, generally, my NIE number is sufficient and I know that off by heart.

I suppose an ID card would be useful when internally travelling as you can use that instead of a passport if you are going on internal flights like Mallorca or Madrid etc. (which we aren't doing at the moment). 

The tobacconist asks my husband for photo ID when buying more than 3 cartons of his ciggies but, usually, his driving licence is fine. If you haven't got a driving licence then maybe the iD card would be better.

Either way, it's so easy to get the TIE (cost is 12 euro plus a photo) that it might be a good idea as it seems pretty sure they will, at some time, become compulsory.

My passport ran out and I don't really want to renew as I have Spanish DL and green card for over 12 years.           Padron accepted old passport because number matched and  today when I was buying a new tv was asked for my surname. The shop ( not a multi National one) had no idea how I was paying. By cash or card.
When typed into screen up came all my names, address and NIE number!

I was flabbergasted especially as similar surnames,but with more letters added on the end plus info pertaining to other people.also appeared. So guess every foreigner totally legit is in the Spanish system. 

My passport ran out and I don't really want to renew as I have Spanish DL and green card for over 12 years.           Padron accepted old passport because number matched and  today when I was buying a new tv was asked for my surname. The shop ( not a multi National one) had no idea how I was paying. By cash or card.
When typed into screen up came all my names, address and NIE number!

I was flabbergasted especially as similar surnames,but with more letters added on the end plus info pertaining to other people.also appeared. So guess every foreigner totally legit is in the Spanish system. 

Floella..I think you will find that even though you are a EU resident in Spain ...you are still British and  still need a up to date British passport...at hand especially when the UK leaves the EU on January 2021.

Thanks as always for more feedback.

I do pay taxes here every year on income (and also the horrible Spanish wealth tax) and I also have to submit a foreign asset declaration form (for uk property and uk bank accounts etc) every year to the Spanish authorities.. I own 2 properties in spain. Can you be doing all that without being officially resident? I just assumed I WAS officially resident.
Yes there is no legal obligation to have a TIE, but legal obligations aside, it would seem that it is really not that necessary to have one if you have a NIE and one or two of you seem to have confirmed that here just above?.

This was written on the site I mentioned previously:
"However, if the thought of a long wait for a TIE appointment puts you off, remember that ”the green residency document gives you the same rights as the new TIE card,” UK Ambassador to Spain Hugh Elliott reiterated."

@carlyoung

Your post opens up more questions. If you are submitting an annual tax return then you will either be doing so as a resident and paying tax on all world wide income or you are submitting a tax return as a non resident and just paying income tax on all earnings in Spain. More than 183 days in one calendar year in Spain would mean you were paying income tax on all income and classed as a resident even if you haven't gone on to the registro (old green card).

If you are paying wealth tax then you are either doing so as a resident on all assets over 2 million euro (in most communities) as that is the allowance for a couple. If as a non resident then wealth tax over 1,400,000 euro (you can't claim a home in Spain as your permanent home if you are a non resident). Figures vary depending on region and Catalonia has a lower allowance and Madrid a higher one. 

If you haven't gone through the formalities of the registro then you could use your income tax returns as proof of residency in Spain. 

Yes, the statement from the British Ambassador and even Moncloa (Spanish equivalent of No 10) have said the green card is a valid document and no need to change to a TIE. You, though, are saying you don't have a green card so you may have a hoop or two more to jump through in the future if they change their minds and make a TIE compulsory.

(I could list the number of changes that I've seen in the years I've lived here. When I first moved over you didn't even need a NIE, you got free healthcare for a certain amount of time regardles of age, you didn't need to show proof of income or health, residents and non-residents were on the padron and so on. All things have changed over time as could the green card and TIE - Never say Never).

Windtalker if it is get a passport or go to jail.....then I will get one. As not even you know for sure. Until then as a fully paid resident of Spain I shall rely solely on their paperwork.

A passport is a travel document (the clue is in the name). There is no legal obligation for anyone to have one. If you are never going to travel abroad, you will never need one.

If (?) the TIE card is the equivalent of Spanish citizens' ID cards, they will allow holders to travel freely within the Schengen area without a passport. (There is I think no question the green paper alone will not be sufficient for this purpose!)

Kavanagh: I'm not claiming to "know better" or have superior knowledge on the subject, I'm simply posing the question, if it's easy enough to get the new TIE card, why not get one? You have never been asked for formal ID whilst in Spain and apparently know that will never happen; however, others apparently have on ocassion been required to produce some ID and are confident it may happen again in the future (I had to produce photo ID last time I changed my phone contract - and for some reason my Spanish drivers licence wasn't acceptable). I guess it all comes down to personal preference - and a bit of crystal ball gazing!

@carlyoung: it seems pretty clear that you are a fully paid up resident! Judging from the remark by the UK ambassador that you quoted, "the green residency document gives you the same rights as the new TIE card”, I would say it's also pretty clear that you really ought to have at least one of the two! If it wasn't for the change in relationship between the UK & Spain due to Brexit, I suppose it really wouldn't be much of an issue, but in your position, for my own peace of mind, I think I would want to formalise my permanent resideny status. Just my personal feeling.

It’s a strange situation; Spain like many countries in the EU has a rule book thicker than the Wheel Tappers and Shunters WMC. I doubt they have ever imprisoned a Brit or EU citizen for a rule book offence, or even ever deported them. It’s all trivia that no one has time to deal with. Even when BREXIT completes it will likely be blind eye rule book.

My thoughts exactly, Roberto. There is no written law that a registered resident in any civilised country has to have a passport . I have sufficient paperwork to prove who I am and where I reside. Have seen the world so no desire to travel  but should an emergency occur, where I had to, then am sure British Consulate will supply necessary documentation.

What actual happens after Brexit, or even tomorrow, no one knows.

True, nobody knows what will happen next.

When I came to Spain you could pretty much get away with anything if you greased the right palms, but things have changed and will continue to change. I'm one of the mugs who has always preferred to do everything I can to make sure I'm squeaky clean and abiding by whatever rules there may be, whether or not they make sense or are ever actually applied. I find I sleep better at night that way, even though it hasn't always kept me from finding myself in frustrating situations through no fault of my own. There are others (who may or may not enjoy tapping wheels for pleasure) who fly by the seat of their pants and never seem to get tripped up. Good luck to them!

The UK Government web site clearly states that before you leave the UK...you should have at least 6 months left on you British passport.... Being a Spanish Tax resident doesn't change the fact that you are a British subject ...so it's fairly obvious that you need a up to date British passport...

That is only for entry purposes.

So what about if you're not leaving the UK, on account of the fact that you haven't actually been there recently? Just Google "what is a passport", or just read the idiots guide to, aka Wikipedia, which startts "A passport is a travel document..."

If you are not traveling internationally, there is no legal requirement for anyone to have one. There is no requirement to have one to live in another country, only to enter it. I can assure you, not all Spaniards living in Spain have one, so for the same reason, British citizens living in Spain don't need one either.

You're welcome.

The UK Government web site clearly states that before you leave the UK you should have at least 6 months left on you British passport.... AGREE, but only for travel purposes. As that is the assumption, that you are visiting not retiring to another country. For most countries 6 months ( 183 days) is the maximum limit a visitors can stay.

Being a Spanish Tax resident doesn't change the fact that you are a British subject ...so it's fairly obvious that you need a up to date British passport... why is it obvious!  To you maybe but show me where the law of Spain or GB states this. Show me.

Plus with TIE card any holder, which I am entitled to be, is all that is required to travel to any other country in the EU.