No escritura for EMASA

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15 Jun 2019 16:42 by Lorenwilson Star rating. 10 posts Send private message

We never had Escritura for our apartment, our Spanish solicitors has been trying to resolve the issue but I’m told it will take more time to get to court.

Emasa are fitting water meters to our building and I was told yesterday that I can only have water to our apt if I show the Escritura otherwise the water will be shut off.

Anyone has any experience of this or what other documents I can use to retain my water supply?





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15 Jun 2019 18:23 by Roberto Star rating in Torremolinos. 4493 posts Send private message

Roberto´s avatar

More info needed. Sounds like the water supply is the least of your worries. If you don't have an escritura, how do you know the apartment is even yours?



_______________________

 

"Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason"

Mark Twain

 

 

 




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15 Jun 2019 19:07 by Lorenwilson Star rating. 10 posts Send private message

I bought the apartment off my father, who bought it off an English lady in the 1980’s, the courts have copies of all the contracts.

My father started the Escritura process but never completed, he kept assuring me it was sorted but he never followed it through.

i gave all the contracts to a solicitor about three years ago, the solicitor said it would take years to come to court.





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15 Jun 2019 19:07 by Lorenwilson Star rating. 10 posts Send private message

I bought the apartment off my father, who bought it off an English lady in the 1980’s, the courts have copies of all the contracts.

My father started the Escritura process but never completed, he kept assuring me it was sorted but he never followed it through.

i gave all the contracts to a solicitor about three years ago, the solicitor said it would take years to come to court.





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15 Jun 2019 20:46 by Roberto Star rating in Torremolinos. 4493 posts Send private message

Roberto´s avatar

Wow. That's a pretty unusual situation. I'd love to help, but I have more questions than answers.

I wonder, what, exactly, is taking years to come to court? Proving ownership? 

How have you been getting your water to date? I'm guessing it's a communal supply, but do you pay for it through your community charge, or just get a bill from Emesa based on a percentage of the total for the building?

Who are Emesa anyway? Where in Spain are you? (quick Google search only found a water company in Mexico by that name!)

Have you spoken to Emesa about your dilemna? 

Do you pay rates (IBI, maybe known as SUMA depending on where you are)? If so, are the bills in your name? Is there a catastral reference on the rates bill? With this you should be able to obtain a nota simple showing who actually owns the property. Even if you can, I'm thinking there's a very good chance it's the lady your father "bought" the apartment off. 

In which case....are you still in contact with the solicitor who is supposedly sorting this issue out for you? If so, have you told them what's happening and asked their advice? They are probably more likely to be able to help than anyone here. And if not....have you considered getting a new lawyer?

I'm sorry I can't offer any advice really. There is a "resident" lawyer on this forum called Maria de Castro. She has helped many members over the years with various property related problems; maybe she will be able to offer something more helpful.

Good luck, and keep us posted - it's certainly an interesting case!

 



_______________________

 

"Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason"

Mark Twain

 

 

 




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15 Jun 2019 21:15 by Lorenwilson Star rating. 10 posts Send private message

The solicitor said that a judge would have to make a judgement on my case and the length of time depends on what court my case goes to and the number other cases more important that take precedence.

My apartment is in Malaga, I can’t pay IBI as I don’t have Escritura!

Our water was previously part of our community charge.

i am getting back in touch with the Solicitor on Monday but I thought I would get some background info in the meantime.

many thanks for your reply, it is indeed a very perplexing problem I have.

E M A S A are the water board in my area.

The electric is supplied by Endesa and is in the Lady in questions name , I haven’t managed to get it changed into my name but at least I can pay it through my Spanish bank account no problem.

Have you heard of people in Spaingetting their water cut off due to not having Escritura?

 I s there a law in Spain giving you the right to access to a water supply if you are willing to pay.

i don’t live in Spain but visit frequently.

 





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15 Jun 2019 23:14 by Roberto Star rating in Torremolinos. 4493 posts Send private message

Roberto´s avatar

Wow! The plot thickens. So....nobody has been paying the IBI since the 1980s? I'm a little surprised the town hall haven't placed an embargo on the property. Perhaps the debt doesn't actually amount to enough for them to bother.

I think (if or when you're in Spain) you should  start  by actually going to Emasa's office (I've found them now with the correct spelling! They have an office by the bullring) I'd explain as best you can the situation, & offer whatever documentation you do have. If you're lucky, and get a reasonable & understanding clerk (unlikely) they may just agree to make a contract in your name, since you're obviously willing to pay.

On the other hand, you could potentially be opening  a can of worms. I don't know about Emasa/ Málaga, but in Torremolinos the water company is owned by the council; if it's the same in Málaga, you could find the council on to you for decades of unpaid IBI.

Probably best to speak to the solicitor first. In answer to your question about people getting their water cut off due to not having Escritura... I've never heard of anyone not having an escritura for a property they supposedly own. As for the legality of cutting off your water supply, unless you can prove that you legally occupy the property, I'm thinking they probably can get away with it in this instance. I hope I'm wrong.

 



_______________________

 

"Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason"

Mark Twain

 

 

 




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16 Jun 2019 10:47 by ads Star rating. 4012 posts Send private message

Good points Roberto.

Noticed these articles which may be of additional assistance, albeit you have bought the property off your father, but it sounds essential that you obtain expert advice from a trusted lawyer ASAP. 

https://www.spanishpropertyinsight.com/2018/11/08/ibi-tax-explained/ (2018)

https://www.spanishpropertyinsight.com/buying-property-in-spain/buying-a-resale-property/the-public-deeds-of-sale/

Also found this old EOS thread (2014) titled “ House purchase but no escritura!“ where Maria provided advice.

https://www.eyeonspain.com/forums/posts-long-20083.aspx

 

 





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18 Jun 2019 13:16 by mariadecastro Star rating in Algeciras (Cadiz). 9290 posts Send private message

Legal Questions? Speak to Maria Direct

I would need to see the contracts before being able to give some opinion ;)

M



_______________________

Maria L. de Castro, JD, MA

Lawyer

Director www.costaluzlawyers.es

El blog de Maria



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19 Jun 2019 10:10 by windtalker Star rating. 1665 posts Send private message

is it just you that has no escatura ...in your community ... have you asked the other owners surely you are paying  for the upkeep of the community buildings/grounds/amenities and so forth ask your president/or the people that manage the buildings... personally from what you are saying with no ecutura in your name you don't pay any bills in you name including IBI or i presume any none residents tax you bought it off your father in I take it in a cash off the cuff agreement with no legal documents from  a notary how on earth are you going to prove that it's yours .... why would you want to prove that it's yours ..just think about all the none residents Tax/IBI /Community fees that you owe...they will add up to many many thousands.

 


 


This message was last edited by windtalker on 19/06/2019.



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19 Jun 2019 15:16 by Lorenwilson Star rating. 10 posts Send private message

I have been paying electric bills and obviously the Community charge over the years. Everyone else in the Community has their Escritura as far as I am aware.

 





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20 Jun 2019 08:57 by mariadecastro Star rating in Algeciras (Cadiz). 9290 posts Send private message

Legal Questions? Speak to Maria Direct

Lorenwilson:

Do you have any purchase contract?



_______________________

Maria L. de Castro, JD, MA

Lawyer

Director www.costaluzlawyers.es

El blog de Maria



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20 Jun 2019 09:57 by Lorenwilson Star rating. 10 posts Send private message

My father has a Spanish purchase contract with the original owner.

my contract with my father was never legalised in Spain., my Spanish Solicitor has both documents.

thanks for the reply, much appreciated.





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20 Jun 2019 12:39 by Jarvi Star rating in Halifax UK and Sucin.... 727 posts Send private message

Lorenwilson.

Just out of interest did you pay the property transfer tax when you bought the property from your Father? (If you did this would at least be proof that you own the property)





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20 Jun 2019 12:56 by Lorenwilson Star rating. 10 posts Send private message

No I didn’t as he didn’t have the Escritura at that time.

Thanks for the reply.

 





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20 Jun 2019 20:15 by Roberto Star rating in Torremolinos. 4493 posts Send private message

Roberto´s avatar

I think it's obvious enough now that there are some serious issues regarding legal ownership of the property, which must be worrying enough for you; but the more urgent issue I suppose is the original question of securing a water meter & contract without the escritura. I wonder if you've had a chance to discuss the situation with Emasa yet?

And Maria, do you have any suggestions on this point? How can Loren prove she lives at the property and ensure that her water supply does not get terminated? 



_______________________

 

"Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason"

Mark Twain

 

 

 




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20 Jun 2019 21:17 by Lorenwilson Star rating. 10 posts Send private message

You have hit the nail on the head Roberto, my immediate concern is getting a water contract.

I am flying to Malaga Monday.

Going to get the papers from EMASA on Tuesday evening from our building administration that’s the earliest I can secure them, and I can only try my best to succeed in my mission to get a water contract before my return on Friday.

Thanks for the replies, keep them coming.

 





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20 Jun 2019 22:01 by Roberto Star rating in Torremolinos. 4493 posts Send private message

Roberto´s avatar

Could you perhaps get the adminstrator to give you a letter stating that, according to their records at least, you are the owner/occupier of the property and have been paying the community fees (and therefore your share of the water!) for X years? 



_______________________

 

"Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason"

Mark Twain

 

 

 




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20 Jun 2019 23:09 by Lorenwilson Star rating. 10 posts Send private message

That sounds like a great idea.

Do you think I should word it for them and ask them to print it on their headed paper.

i think they are specialist administrators but have only been employed by our community for a couple of years, upnuntil tgen we employed a lawyer one day a week, but she left to raise a family.





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21 Jun 2019 01:42 by Roberto Star rating in Torremolinos. 4493 posts Send private message

Roberto´s avatar

Maybe compose something yourself for them to transpose & authorise, but allow them to reword it if they see fit. 

Another thought occurred to me - based on the circumstances you've explained, I wonder if you have an NIE number? I  wonder if it's even possible for Emasa to issue a contract to someone without one? Either way, expect at the very least to have to produce ID (passport) and a copy or two.

 



_______________________

 

"Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason"

Mark Twain

 

 

 




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