Terminating Rental Contract Problem - Help Needed

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07 Aug 2008 12:00 AM by damok666 Star rating in Sunderland. 75 posts Send private message

We have to go back to the UK due to a serious illness in the family and so unfortunately we have to end our rental after only 5 months of a 6 month contract.  Our agent claims that as we are ending the contract a month early we have to pay the final month to the landlord as compensation for ending the contract early.  Our contract states regarding termination:

Notice of Termination

(a) The tenant shall give one months notice of termination of Tenancy

(b) The landlord shall give one months notice of termination of tenancy or two months notice of termination of tenancy if the property is for sale ans a purchaser for the property is found
.

To be honest a new excuse comes out from her for this extra payment every time I challenge it and basically say its bollocks.  I have had 2 previous rentals in Spain and they were both set as 1 months notice at any time of the contract and that would end all ties.

Can anyone help me please?

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07 Aug 2008 1:49 PM by morerosado Star rating. 6927 posts Send private message

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Seems clear to me Damok. Has the agent your cc details or could they manage to debit more money from you ? If the answer is no, threaten the agent with legal action, spout Maria de Castro's name at them, put the fear of God into them

I guess you've likely paid a deposit for breakages though which the agent may keep if they choose to ignore their contract with you, am I right ?

Sorry to hear you have a serious illness in the family, you can do without all this agent carry on, can't you ?

All the very best.

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07 Aug 2008 2:18 PM by damok666 Star rating in Sunderland. 75 posts Send private message

Hi More, your exactly right - a bond equivalent to 2 months rental.  They couldnt get any more money from us after we stop the payment but she will keep the deposit I'm 99% sure.  Is Maria a solicitor?  I wonder if she may be able to help clear it up.

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07 Aug 2008 2:24 PM by morerosado Star rating. 6927 posts Send private message

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Maria de Castro is a lawyer, yes.

She posts on EOS helping people all the time. She'll sort you out, don't worry. 

Send her a PM (her sitename is "mariadecastro" without spaces).

Or email her on mldecastro@costaluzlawyers.es     or    marialuisa@costaluzlawyers.es


Maria L. De Castro, JD, MA

Lawyer

Director www.costaluzlawyers.es



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07 Aug 2008 2:40 PM by damok666 Star rating in Sunderland. 75 posts Send private message

Thanks More, I've sent her a PM

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07 Aug 2008 2:43 PM by morerosado Star rating. 6927 posts Send private message

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21 Aug 2008 11:05 AM by alcaidesa-sotogrande Star rating. 17 posts Send private message

if you have paid one months rent deposit I would advise you not to pay your last months rent and leave the deposit you paid for the agents. Otherwise they take your deposit for the last months rent.

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21 Aug 2008 1:39 PM by damok666 Star rating in Sunderland. 75 posts Send private message

Yeah we had paid 2 months - so 1 will be for that month and we will never see the rest.  We have heard some stories about this agent that makes your skin crawl and your blood boil - this is why agents and Spain gets a bad name for this sort of thing.

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21 Aug 2008 2:04 PM by abbbb1 Star rating in Essex and Ciudad Que.... 306 posts Send private message

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Don't know if the law is the same in Spain and England, but if you give one month's notice on a 6 month contract, and you give it at the end of month 5 (and up to that time you have paid the equivalent of 5 months rent) you still have to pay for that final month.  Like the landlord has to give to 2 months notice, in most contracts, but he still expects to receive rent for those two months.  Over the here the deposit is separated from the rental, and the deposit is held onto by various systems until the house is checked,  If the complete return of the money is agreed then it has to be applied for, usually from one of the holding firms.  If there is no agreement then it goes to arbitration.   I know that it works that way in England, because I deal with the rental contracts.  However, no doubt Spain is a different kettle of fish!

However, I would have thought that the agents/landlord would have shown some leniency in the case of illness.

I wish you well in getting this sorted out, and hope that the medical problems soon resolve themselves.



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21 Aug 2008 2:21 PM by damok666 Star rating in Sunderland. 75 posts Send private message

I gave notice at the end of month 4 not 5, so when I leave we will only be 5 months into the 6 months CONtract.

The agent has never asked why we want to leave or what the circumstances are. When she started to be difficult I asked if she was even interested she just said no.  Its because I am not worth any money to her any more.

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21 Aug 2008 2:40 PM by mariadecastro Star rating in Algeciras (Cadiz). 9402 posts Send private message

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If you gave to him a guarantee of 1 month fee, you are not obliged to pay anything else.

Best,

Maria

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Director www.costaluzlawyers.es

El blog de Maria



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21 Aug 2008 2:46 PM by headghogg Star rating in La Zenia. 16 posts Send private message

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I was reading this and thought I would just give you a little comment from an agent's side...I’m not saying who might be right or wrong!
 
Consider the client that states his/her intention to rent for say 6 months. The request comes in sometime in May and the renta is to start in July. All seems OK, deposit and 1 month up front is taken and the client moves in. The client then states he wants to give a months notice…doesn’t like the place or needs to go back home or whatever. Nice short term rental in peak season for a long term rental price? I AM NOT SUGGESTING THIS IS THE CASE just so you know this trype of thing happens and the agent is the one left to explain to the owner!
 
The thing here is that when someone takes on a rental contract for 6 months the price is set accordingly. We always ensure people know they are committing to a period of rent for a total price which you can pay over time. If you choose not to occupy the property for part of that period then that is your choice. This is different to a paying month for a month.
 
Regarding the original query I think you will find that the contract is the key thing here. As long as the contract does not contravene Spanish law and that both parties will benefit from the contract (standard contract law) then whatever was agreed will be enforceable. The security deposit is just that and is not meant to be used to pay for the last months rent.
 
Imagine another scenario. The renter uses the security deposit to pay the last months rent, cancelling the DD for that last month. The renter then leaves the property and there is no money to cover any repairs or to cover the €200 of unpaid bills!
 
Its not an easy job renting property in a country which sees people just up and go leaving debts and repairs that an agent is responsible for putting right.
 


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21 Aug 2008 3:08 PM by damok666 Star rating in Sunderland. 75 posts Send private message

Well, just so you know, we have been renting in Spain for 2 years now and had no intention of leaving but for this sudden reason.

It was never made clear to me that I had to pay 6 months - in fact the very words used were 'To terminate you just have to give a months notice'.

Oh, and the DD is certainly cancelled.

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21 Aug 2008 3:18 PM by headghogg Star rating in La Zenia. 16 posts Send private message

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Dear damok666

This was definitely NOT meant to be directed to you and relating to YOUR specific case. I am very sorry if you read it this way.

There are always cases which should be treated
 independently and with consideration to the personal circumstances of the client. While we rely on our strict contracts we ALWAYS have the right to show compasion and we have done so on many occassions, but this is always our choice and after consideration of the facts. It seems you have been unfortunate in your dealings with this agent who quite clearly gives a damn about your personal circumstances.

Where abouts in Spain are you/is the agent?



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21 Aug 2008 3:19 PM by abbbb1 Star rating in Essex and Ciudad Que.... 306 posts Send private message

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And speaking from the perspective of a landlord in England.......!!!! Depending on what type of contract, and going back to England again where contracts can roll over, for a further period,  unless there is a notice given - (usually two months on both sides) the term of the contract will be held to.

Looking at Maria's answer there seems to be quite a difference between the renting structure.  Perhaps I might have expected that.

I am with a good  agent (I hope!!) for letting my property in Spain at the moment.  I wanted to put it in the hands of the professionals rather than try to managed it from here.  However, two were not quite as professional as I would have hoped!  One let my property without an inventory (although they had it), and of course, when there were a lot of things missing.  At the end of the tenancy the agent, and ultimately myself didn't have a leg to stand on.  So they paid the deposit back to the tenant - whilst I grimaced!!!  The agent offered to let my property again - but I declined.  The second agent let my property on and off over a period of 18months.  When I visited the property at the end of the stay, with my copy of the inventory in hand, again I found many things missing/damaged!  The agent had given the deposit back to the tenant.  When I ask them why, I was told that they didn't have time to do a final check. And they were supposed to be working for me!!  With friends like that you don't need enemies!   We agreed a figure of compensation that they (the agents) were going to pay me - and two years on I wait - without hope that it will materialise!!  In all I have lost at least a couple of thousand euros over the missing/damaged items which I have had to replace/repair.

So, I guess that there are lots of sides to this renting problem.

 



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21 Aug 2008 3:28 PM by headghogg Star rating in La Zenia. 16 posts Send private message

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We hear nightmares on a regular basis. And I am not afraid to admit that we have failed on occasion but we do hold our hands up and admit to this but never for the amounts abbbb1 has mentioned…that’s just ridiculous.
 
Anyway you are right it is difficult. Another this to consider as an owner is TAX!
 
I don’t know anyone (allegedly) who declares the income to either Spanish or any other countries authorities. This is an issue at the moment. The authorities here are clamping down hard on this and as a fully registered tax paying company we know its only a matter of time until our records are inspected. We warn all our property owners about this but they see it somehow as some scan to get more money from them.
 
I am not sure where damok666 is in Spain but if we can help we will!


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21 Aug 2008 3:28 PM by damok666 Star rating in Sunderland. 75 posts Send private message

headghogg - We are in Pinoso at the minute.

abbb1 - I have the opposite problem.  An inventory was never made but I have been told by more than one person who has rented through this agent that she will turn up with an inventory and basically make up a load of crap until my deposit has dissapreared into alleged damage and excessive wear.  I have also been told no-one EVER gets their deposit back from this agent one way or another.

Maria - I gave 2 months rent as deposit.

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21 Aug 2008 3:34 PM by headghogg Star rating in La Zenia. 16 posts Send private message

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I am quite some way from there I am afraid!

But I have been thinking about starting a website dedicated to shaming agents AND bad tenants where people can lodge information about different agents and even non paying clients (there are clients who do this almost for a living). If you think this will be useful I will dedicate more time to getting this off the ground?
 
Damok666, how much do you think you will loose over this?
 


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21 Aug 2008 4:09 PM by damok666 Star rating in Sunderland. 75 posts Send private message

Headghogg - that is a cracking idea!  For people on both sides of the fence.

I luckily think I will only lose about 600 Euros.  They have 1700 as deposit, apparentely by law I have to pay one months rent leaving 850.  I admit there may be around 200 Euros of Bills so I think about 600ish Euros.  

In the grand scheme of things its not a lot i know but still not nice when in my previous 2 rentals in Spain I never had so much as a crossed word with my agent / landlord and got all my deposits back in full.  As renters we really make a huge effort to keep the place nice (not easy sometimes with a young baby and a large dog).


This message was last edited by damok666 on 8/21/2008.

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21 Aug 2008 4:10 PM by morerosado Star rating. 6927 posts Send private message

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Hi Damok, why do you have Campoverde as your location if you're in Pinoso ?

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