Patronising "No Reply" email

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27 Mar 2019 14:13 by acer Star rating. 1394 posts Send private message

I don't like receiving emails from "No Reply" sources, even more so when they say rubbish.

I signed the Revoke Article 50 petition as IMHO it's the only simple way out of a ghastly mess, which it was from the outset - and as yet it's far from over.

The last thing I now wish to receive is some "holier than thou" gobbledegook to which I cannot respond, so posting on EOS.  Perhaps a bit of a long shot that one of the committee politico minions who wrote this twaddle visits EOS, but you never know.

Let's be honest we were generally happy being in the EU - it was Cameron sucking up to the right wing of the Tory party that brought this about.  

If you read the supercilious, anonymous, email received below you may understand.

(I feel a bit better now).


Dear Mr Acer,

The Government has responded to the petition you signed – “Revoke Article 50 and remain in the EU.”.

Government responded:

This Government will not revoke Article 50. We will honour the result of the 2016 referendum and work with Parliament to deliver a deal that ensures we leave the European Union.

It remains the Government’s firm policy not to revoke Article 50. We will honour the outcome of the 2016 referendum and work to deliver an exit which benefits everyone, whether they voted to Leave or to Remain.

Revoking Article 50, and thereby remaining in the European Union, would undermine both our democracy and the trust that millions of voters have placed in Government.

The Government acknowledges the considerable number of people who have signed this petition. However, close to three quarters of the electorate took part in the 2016 referendum, trusting that the result would be respected. This Government wrote to every household prior to the referendum, promising that the outcome of the referendum would be implemented. 17.4 million people then voted to leave the European Union, providing the biggest democratic mandate for any course of action ever directed at UK Government.

British people cast their votes once again in the 2017 General Election where over 80% of those who voted, voted for parties, including the Opposition, who committed in their manifestos to upholding the result of the referendum.

This Government stands by this commitment.

Revoking Article 50 would break the promises made by Government to the British people, disrespect the clear instruction from a democratic vote, and in turn, reduce confidence in our democracy. As the Prime Minister has said, failing to deliver Brexit would cause “potentially irreparable damage to public trust”, and it is imperative that people can trust their Government to respect their votes and deliver the best outcome for them.

Department for Exiting the European Union.

Click this link to view the response online:

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/241584?reveal_response=yes

This petition has over 100,000 signatures. The Petitions Committee will consider it for a debate. They can also gather further evidence and press the government for action.

The Committee is made up of 11 MPs, from political parties in government and in opposition. It is entirely independent of the Government. Find out more about the Committee: https://petition.parliament.uk/help#petitions-committee

Thanks,
The Petitions team
UK Government and Parliament



_______________________
Don't argue with an idiot, he will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.



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27 Mar 2019 15:19 by acer Star rating. 1394 posts Send private message

Now received an email saying that the petition is going to be debated in the House on 1st April, mmmm no comment re choice of dates. 

I believe this is the nomal procedure, but either way it's a bit more like it - anything else would be even more contemptuous.  



_______________________
Don't argue with an idiot, he will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.



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27 Mar 2019 17:46 by angeleyes1 Star rating in Camposol & Bradford. 406 posts Send private message

angeleyes1´s avatar

This is one of the negatives of the internet we all suffer and to some degree of your own making. If you make just one single enquiry to OXFAM, the next week you will receive emails from every beggar and scammer in the world. Perhaps it’s worth keeping a separate private email address for close family and friends, if you have any. Use a different email address for your Hilda Ogden activities that you can just delete when you become too popular with the Nigerian lottery winner results.



_______________________
When you have to shoot, shoot, don't talk.



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27 Mar 2019 18:30 by Roberto Star rating in Torremolinos. 4523 posts Send private message

Roberto´s avatar

Since the government has already rejected the petition (sign here if you haven't already), WTF are they supposedly going to debate on April Farage Day?

Since Mrs.May (our democratically un-elected leader) apparently believes that more democracy is un-democratic, it's probably equally pointless at this stage of the game, but if you would like to receive some more banal e-mail in response to trying to make a difference, why not sign this one too?

https://www.change.org/p/theresa-may-mp-give-people-a-final-say-on-brexit-deal?fbclid=IwAR1F7jmq0RpDvvbCQ2zbqW4dVrjnuG_i1vVtiLPEtjEtSnLYGnfqR7Hg2lI



_______________________

 

"Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please"

Mark Twain

 

 

 




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27 Mar 2019 20:13 by acer Star rating. 1394 posts Send private message

"Nigel Farage Day" is very apt - nice one.

I reckon that "Brexit" should enter the dictionary too, in the context of "making a Brexit of it".  Although perhaps it's something best forgotten.



_______________________
Don't argue with an idiot, he will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.



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28 Mar 2019 10:42 by Mickyfinn Star rating in Spain and France. 1837 posts Send private message

Regular posters on here will not be surprised to learn I have signed every remain petition issued since the referendum. there are about twenty so far. I have also made financial contributions to many separate campaign groups including the second referendum groups Sodem et al. Even been on demos.

Not content with my self inflicted efforts there is never a day goes by when I don't receive emails asking for more. More money, more lobbying, more demos, more of the same. Some of the government petitions over 100K signatures actually make it to debates which are held in a separate committee anti-room with about three and a half MP's, not in the parliament. They end in a bland declaration to continue to do nothing.

Campaigning is a thankless, frustrating business on this subject but if you care as much as I do there is no choice. I'm now hearing Brexit has caused the greatest UK parliamentary crisis for 300 years. Not since Guy Fawkes tried to blow the institution to kingdom come has there been such disorder.

Dave Cameron should be squirming in his shoes and have sleepless nights. I sincerely hope so.



_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn Time is the fire in which we burn. Delmore Schwartz.



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28 Mar 2019 11:19 by angeleyes1 Star rating in Camposol & Bradford. 406 posts Send private message

angeleyes1´s avatar

‘’there is never a day goes by when I don't receive emails asking for more. More money’’

Oh dear oh dear, just like charities and every other scam, 1p to the cause and 99p in someone’s back pocket. Will we ever learn?



_______________________
When you have to shoot, shoot, don't talk.



Like 3      
28 Mar 2019 12:11 by Roberto Star rating in Torremolinos. 4523 posts Send private message

Roberto´s avatar

David Cameron is giving after dinner speeches at £120,000 a pop on how to destroy a country without actually going to war. Squirming he is not :-(



_______________________

 

"Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please"

Mark Twain

 

 

 




Like 2      
31 Mar 2019 00:20 by suzyhart Star rating. 24 posts Send private message

Hi All,

I know this might make me sound a bit thick, but can somebody explain to me what a no deal brexit will actually mean,  I keep hearing on the uk news that it will be deasterous for the uk to leave with a no deal.  What will it also mean to british people whom have a holiday home in Spain.

Thanks in advance

suzy





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31 Mar 2019 08:10 by Mickyfinn Star rating in Spain and France. 1837 posts Send private message

It means no transition period and no trade deals with the EU. Britain becomes a third country in terms of it's the nation's relationship with the EU.

British nationals living in Spain will have to rely on bilateral treaties for their healthcare and other rights they currently have. Freedom of movement and employment rights in all EU countries will end. Uk driving licences will no longer be recognised and an IDP will be required. Pet passports between EU and UK will require more procedures. UK nationals coming on holiday will be granted three-month visa-free entry provided they complete ETIAS procedures online and pay a fee. British people applying for residency in Spain will be required to produce evidence they have income in excess of €28k per annum, plus €6k for a spouse. Sterling is expected to drop to parity with the Euro and remain at that value for some time until trade deals with the EU are restored.

No deal also involves many other negative issues for Britain but they are unlikely to impact holiday visitors except likely travel delays and some disruption.



_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn Time is the fire in which we burn. Delmore Schwartz.



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31 Mar 2019 10:20 by acer Star rating. 1394 posts Send private message

Suzy - Mickyfinn has provided a good summary of the possible negative outcome of Brexit.  The other side is the reverse - that we'll be far better off without having to pay huge amounts of money to subsidise the half the peoples of Europe, to maintain the gravy train of Brussels who waste our money on hideous volumes of bureaucracy, including passing laws which are gradually taking away our independence as a nation.  Plus giving us back our powers to control immigration so that our public services are not overwhelmed and jobs are protected.

In economic terms Brexiteers believe that our freedom outside the EU will enable us to find new markets to expand the number of countries with which we trade and be far better off in the future.

The problem is that both sides of opinion are fairly equally divided and both believe they are right.  Whereas in the House of Commons the MPs are quietly in favour of staying in Europe, so they are applying the brakes to the process as best they can.

I clearly recall the time when we joined the EU and not much changed.  But the "free movement" aspect may become a pain - on the other hand it is likely that in Spain they will not enforce the rules as robustly as other countries as they have no desire to ruin their own economy.  The last thing the Spanish want is a sudden exodus of Brits, or a big reduction to the number of tourists.

That won't answer your question as it depends on which version you believe.  But it's difficult to see how leaving the EU will be good for those who live in Spain or visit regularly - the trading and economic situation is far less clear.  Leaving without agreeing a deal may provoke additional hostility and lose us large volumes of business, somme due to the additional taxes imposed on goods we export.  Personally I take the view "if it ain't broke don't fix it" but who knows?  Lot's think they do, which is the reason for the impasse.



_______________________
Don't argue with an idiot, he will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.



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31 Mar 2019 11:24 by Mickyfinn Star rating in Spain and France. 1837 posts Send private message

I think for genuine British tourists visiting Spain there's unlikely to be much impact. However there is a class of Brit who pretend they are tourists but in reality they are residents. Commonly known as 'living under the radar' . These people, of which there are many are going to have to face up to the reality that the parties over. Especially in a no deal scenario.

The reason will be simple as the relationship with Spain and the UK changes. Greater controls and documentation on the movements and behaviour of third country nationals, no EHIC for healthcare, driving licences not recognised, ETITAS will record movements at the click of a mouse. It may still be possible for such people to manage it but its going to involve much future hassle.



_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn Time is the fire in which we burn. Delmore Schwartz.



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31 Mar 2019 12:45 by Kavanagh Star rating in Oil Drum Lane Newcas.... 994 posts Send private message

Kavanagh´s avatar

It won’t make the slightest bit of difference. This is all scar mongering. Spain has never enforced residency rules or ever prosecuted, fined or deported any Brits for not complying. The reality is any Brit with 5 bob is welcomed with open arms no matter what Ronnie Rulebook says.



_______________________
There is enough in the world for everyone, but not enough for the greedy!



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31 Mar 2019 13:02 by Mickyfinn Star rating in Spain and France. 1837 posts Send private message

That may have been true when Britain was an EU partner and member of the club. Outside it relationships will be different. A useful yardstick is to ask any American since America is a third nation-state. Or Australian if they have vias or residency hassle. Of course, if you simply live in a country and do absolutely nothing about your status in it you won't have a problem until you have a problem. Then the questions get asked.



_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn Time is the fire in which we burn. Delmore Schwartz.



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31 Mar 2019 13:57 by Kavanagh Star rating in Oil Drum Lane Newcas.... 994 posts Send private message

Kavanagh´s avatar

‘’British people applying for residency in Spain will be required to produce evidence they have income in excess of €28k per annum, plus €6k for a spouse.’’

If that became the case they would be encouraging and promoting under the radar non compliance.

I can just image the Spanish authorities having a discussion:-

Let’s make it as difficult as possible for British expats our biggest expat market to come to Spain with their spending money and life savings to buy our houses. We don’t need them with only 40% youth unemployment.



_______________________
There is enough in the world for everyone, but not enough for the greedy!



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31 Mar 2019 15:12 by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5246 posts Send private message

Quote.  

Let’s make it as difficult as possible for British expats our biggest expat market to come to Spain with their spending money and life savings to buy our houses. We don’t need them with only 40% youth unemployment.

Applying those conditions, which are exactly the same as apply now to all non EU nationals, so nothing unfair about it unless one thinks brits are entitled to a better deal than the rest of the world, including former Spanish colonies.





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31 Mar 2019 15:32 by Kavanagh Star rating in Oil Drum Lane Newcas.... 994 posts Send private message

Kavanagh´s avatar

John I never said it would be unfair, but in the authentic world it would be economic suicide.

Spain and UK BREXIT boils down to the land of economic reality and the daydream land of scaremongers who have thrown the teddy out of the pram and trying to recruit others in the course of trepidation.



_______________________
There is enough in the world for everyone, but not enough for the greedy!



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31 Mar 2019 15:37 by Mickyfinn Star rating in Spain and France. 1837 posts Send private message

Kavanagh.

If you do some research on the web regarding third country visa applications for Spanish residency you will find the list of the legal requirements. It is not a case of Spain making life difficult for Brits post no deal Brexit. The law is simply that as third country nationals British people will be treated equally.

Leaving the EU has negative consequences. Some say it's a price worth paying. The future will reveal if it is. In the referendum on British EU membership in 1974 it was explained to everyone how Britain had suffered post war economic decline because it was not able to trade freely with Europe. That fact and subcequent prosperity seems to have left the British conciousness.

 



_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn Time is the fire in which we burn. Delmore Schwartz.



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31 Mar 2019 15:51 by Kavanagh Star rating in Oil Drum Lane Newcas.... 994 posts Send private message

Kavanagh´s avatar

If you did some proper research you would find British passport holders are visa exempt in many places throughout the world and likely to be for Spain after BREXIT. Fake information is of no benefit to anyone.



_______________________
There is enough in the world for everyone, but not enough for the greedy!



Like 1      
31 Mar 2019 16:15 by Mickyfinn Star rating in Spain and France. 1837 posts Send private message

Perhaps you have misunderstood my post. I was referring to residencia applications from British people in Spain post a no deal Brexit. NOT VISITORS which you rightly point out are visa free.save the requirement to register on ETITAS.  



_______________________
Time is the school in which we learn Time is the fire in which we burn. Delmore Schwartz.



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