NIE/non-resident certificate

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05 Mar 2011 00:00 by JillB1 Star rating. 1 posts Send private message

HI,

I'm looking to buy a property in Berja and need an NIE and also, in order to oepn a bank account, a non-residents' certificate.

 

Does anyone know for certain how long it will take to get these papers from the Malaga police station?

 

Secondly, Is it all right to do this in Malaga if the property is somewhere else?  The nearest national police station to the property would be in Almeria but we have heard it can take 4 to 10 days from there and we only have 3 days on this trip, hence the desire to get it done in Malaga if possible.

 

Thanks for any help

 

 





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06 Mar 2011 12:28 by amep75 Star rating. 79 posts Send private message

 you dont need nie to open bank account in spain just your passport





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06 Mar 2011 13:08 by claire T Star rating in Torremendo, Orihuela. 689 posts Send private message

EOS Supporter

Hi Jill - the system is different in each area and I know that in Torrevieja they have recently changed the rules (again!!) and you can only apply for the NIE after you have purchased your property.  Just a few weeks ago it was the reverse - you couldn't buy without it!  Previously you had to show your reservation contract to even apply for the number, as they would only issue the certificate if they were sure you were going to buy in their area.  For a National ID number this seems crazy - but then so are many of the rules here! 

Wherever you are, I doubt very much that you can get your NIE on such a short trip.  You can make the application and nominate someone to collect it on your behalf - this could be your lawyer if you are giving them power of attorney or your estate agent.  The Notary will often accept the application form with a guarantee that the number will be notified to them when it is available. 

I do however still see adverts in the free papers saying people can get your NIE within a day, and we used to be able to do this for clients, but am not sure how they do this now.

So - in short - ask your lawyer or estate agent about the local rules! 



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06 Mar 2011 16:41 by kenoldroofer Star rating. 2 posts Send private message

 What is n.i.e. ? after five years residency which starts from the time you register you are entitled to the same rights as nationals so

I would reccomend new arrivals to register their residency right away only costs about 6 euros.





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06 Mar 2011 17:54 by claire T Star rating in Torremendo, Orihuela. 689 posts Send private message

EOS Supporter

Hi - an NIE is a national identity number - similar the UK National Insurance number.  You cannot buy a property in Spain without one.



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06 Mar 2011 17:55 by amep75 Star rating. 79 posts Send private message

 of course you can just use passport





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06 Mar 2011 18:39 by foxbat Star rating in Granada. 1114 posts Send private message

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Amep...

wrong again!

Most banks insist on an NIE for opening a bank account, and you most certainly cannot complete a property purchase without  it.

95% of what you post on this forum is incorrect information.

Why do you think people ignore your posts.?



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06 Mar 2011 18:45 by bobaol Star rating. 2257 posts Send private message

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 You also can't purchase a car without the NIE. (well, that's in the Torrevieja area and surrounding parts).  Each car firm I have been to require a copy of the deeds or long term rental agreement, passport and NIE.  Also, another new one, my bank asked me to provide my NIE so they could take a copy before I was allowed to withdraw money from my account (well, not quite,  they allowed me to withdraw money but wanted the NIE before my next withdrawal).

 

 





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06 Mar 2011 20:49 by kenoldroofer Star rating. 2 posts Send private message

 Thanks for that Clare, and Foxbat I opened my bank account with a D.N.I. not an I.N.E. I don't have a I.N.E. as far as I know and 

although I am not going to buy a property, would it be in my interest to get one? if it is like the British national insurance number as

a British insurance number allows one into the social system perhaps it would allow me to get my British basic pension braught

up to the level of the minimum Spanish pension, there appears to be a new European directive along these lines for instance

European nationals can come to the UK looking for work and go on our job seekers allowance providing that they can prove that they are looking for work.





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06 Mar 2011 21:33 by foxbat Star rating in Granada. 1114 posts Send private message

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Ken...

Unlike some people on this forum I cannot will not comment on things I am uncertain about.

So far as I am aware a DNI serves the same purpose as an NIE but I could be wrong.

As for the other points you raise I cannot comment.

Is there that much difference between the UK State Pension and the Spanish?

Anyone else up to speed on the other points raised?

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06 Mar 2011 21:51 by bobaol Star rating. 2257 posts Send private message

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 I thought the DNI (Documento Nacional de Identidad) was only for native Spaniards?
NIE and NIF are the same (Numero de Identificacion Extranjero and .........Fiscal) as they are both the same numbers and are issued to EU and non-EU citiizens.

I know when we first bought we didn't have to have the NIE either to purchase or to open a bank account.  In fact, we owned our flat for about 2 years until we got round to getting the NIE.

They changed the rules and then you couldn't buy (or long term rent) or open a bank account without the NIE.  I think that was about 3 or 4 years ago.  Mind you, they keep changing the rules.  After all, 2 years ago nobody bothered with Habitacion Certificate and now you can't sell without one.  

Ho hum, difficult to keep up, isn't it?

 





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30 Jun 2011 08:57 by Johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5239 posts Send private message


 


An NIE (Numero de Identificación Extranjeros) has been a legal requirement in Spain for many years.  In theory, one cannot make any financial transaction without one. 

 

The number enables the Spanish Tax authority (sometimes referred to as Hacienda)  to view all transactions and bank accounts which use the number.  (And remember, the 'Hacienda' have a close exchange of info with HMRC (HM Inland Revenue).





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30 Jun 2011 10:57 by sneezey Star rating. 64 posts Send private message

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If you are buying a property I would imagine that you have a Lawyer who is taking care of your interests in the purchase of your property, at least I hope this is the case. The Lawyer would be able to get all these documents for you as part of his service, so I would speak to them.

If you haven't got a lawyer then take care, there are a lot of things that need to be checked out before you purchase a property, just look at the bloggs on this site if you think you can go it alone.





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30 Jun 2011 11:50 by Faro Star rating in London. 1139 posts Send private message

sneezey

I'm not sure your argument holds water.

Even with a lawyer you could still end up a mess as many on here will be able to confirm!





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01 Jul 2011 04:54 by sneezey Star rating. 64 posts Send private message

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Of course there are bad Lawyers out there. Even so I think that as long as you get a reputable Lawyer that has been reccommended by someone who has already used one then  it must be safer than purchasing in a foreign country in a language that you don't understand without any help at all. I'm sure there are more problems in cases where people haven't done this, You just have to be careful who you choose, and make sure they have an insurance to cover their clients if something does go wrong. 





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01 Jul 2011 09:37 by Johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5239 posts Send private message

 

Sneezey,   you have a lot more confidence in the legal profession than I have.  After working closely with them for 30 years in UK,  I tend to agree with Faro.  I would never employ a lawyer unless I had no other option.

 

I have bought and sold several properties here in Spain, never used a lawyer, and so far (may be have been lucky) never had any problems. On two occasions the Notary (did his job) would not let the process proceed until a couple of matters had been resolved.  The Notary has a duty to ensure that the property being transferred is 'free' from restrictions and that all debts have been paid.  He/she gets an Information from the Property Registry within 24 hours before the transfer.

 


 



This message was last edited by Johnzx on 01/07/2011.



This message was last edited by Johnzx on 01/07/2011.



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01 Jul 2011 09:44 by sneezey Star rating. 64 posts Send private message

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 I think you've been lucky, there can be debts related to the property that do not appear on the Nota Simple, For example electridcity, community charges, water, rates, rubbish collection, all these must be checked too. Also there could be outstanding tax. Also you have to understand what the Nota Simple actually says to be sure.





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01 Jul 2011 09:57 by Johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5239 posts Send private message

Sneezey,

 

Don't wanna be argumentative but that is what the Notary is obliged to do. 

 

Quote " As part of your purchase procedure, the Notary will verify that the property you are buying is legally owned and registered to the vendor, that it is free of all costs and charges, and that it comes with vacant possession. S/he will be able to offer an official translation of the documents involved in your completion, if required."

 

 

I agree there could still be a problem but in such a case I would not be surprised if almost any lawyer you might employ would fail to pick up on it.  Even though lawyer carry some insurance, having close knowledge of the Law Society (they investigate solicitors) in UK I also have very little confidence in a client getting any sort of reasonable protection,

 

But just my view,

 


 



This message was last edited by Johnzx on 01/07/2011.



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01 Jul 2011 12:28 by jek Star rating. 249 posts Send private message

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Quote " As part of your purchase procedure, the Notary will verify that the property you are buying is legally owned and registered to the vendor, that it is free of all costs and charges, and that it comes with vacant possession. S/he will be able to offer an official translation of the documents involved in your completion, if required."

Translation: The notary will go online and get a nota simple from the Property Registry on the day of the sale.  That will say whether there are any charges (mortgages or secured loans) against the property, or any embargoes - debts where the creditor has gone to court and got a judgement that says that the property may not be legally sold until that debt is discharged.  Sneezey is right when he says that the notary will not check for other debts.  That's the lawyer's job.  And as for vacant possession, that's a joke.  The notary will ask the seller if it has vacant possession.  The seller says yes.  The notary will ask the buyer if he is satisfied there is vacant possession.  Buyer says yes.  End of.

Using a lawyer to buy a property in Spain is, generally speaking, a total lottery.  Johnzx will almost certainly do a better job if he knows the ropes.  No doubt the same is true of Faro and others who have experience and know what to look out for.  But for most lawyers all you will get is a quick look at the nota simple and a translator at the notary.  It's a very real problem.





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