The Government wants help with Red-Tape Reform!

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02 Jan 2013 18:23 by eos_ian Star rating in Valencia. 496 posts Send private message

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AN ONLINE suggestion box set up by the central government lets members of the public voice their opinions on public administration services. Two links on the sitehttp://www.seap.minhap.gob.es/areas/reforma_aapp.html allow people to give their views on how to cut down on duplication and red tape. Mariano Rajoy says he wants to put in place a system for admin which the general public have to go through involving town halls and other government offices which is 'simple, modern and dynamic'.

This is our opportunity to say everything we have to say about Spain's nightmare bureaucracy!!! Will they listen? :)

So, where do you start with this?

 


This message was last edited by eos_ian on 02/01/2013.

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02 Jan 2013 19:04 by CostaBlade Star rating in Riviera. 115 posts Send private message

Can you imagine some posters from EOS advising the Goverment, Bloody 'ell  !!!





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03 Jan 2013 12:36 by norm de plume Star rating in North Tenerife and L.... 162 posts Send private message

I've just tried to tell them their online system for non-resident tax does not work.  It will not acept an NIE!





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04 Jan 2013 14:37 by mac75 Star rating in Valencia. 409 posts Send private message

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 Brilliant this is everyone's chance to help improve the greatest concern expats have - Red Tape! In the poll I did a couple of months ago over 40% of all the voters said bureaucracy was their number one concern. 

www.eyeonspain.com/blogs/MACpoll/8173/test-post.aspx

I will cetainly be giving it some thought from a residents points of view but it would be interesting to see what the red tape problems really are for expats and how they could be improved. If everyone posted suggestions here maybe the guys from EOS could pass the suggestions on to the government as a community :) !! This has the potential to be a rather interesting thread!  



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04 Jan 2013 14:40 by mac75 Star rating in Valencia. 409 posts Send private message

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"I've just tried to tell them their online system for non-resident tax does not work" 

Suggestion Nº1 -  FIX IT!  :)

 


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04 Jan 2013 15:01 by norm de plume Star rating in North Tenerife and L.... 162 posts Send private message

The suggestion site will not accept suggestions from non-residents.  Once again we are excluded from any input.  Perhaps a resident could make the complaint for us, and point this fact out.

 


This message was last edited by norm de plume on 04/01/2013.



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04 Jan 2013 16:31 by mac75 Star rating in Valencia. 409 posts Send private message

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I wasn't aware that the suggestion site will not allow NIE's so if there are enough constructive suggestions I will happily present the suggestions on everyone's behalf. Start posting.....

 


 


This message was last edited by mac75 on 04/01/2013.

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04 Jan 2013 16:40 by eos_ian Star rating in Valencia. 496 posts Send private message

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mac75,  If  this is a topic of great concern, as I think it is, I will be pleased to pull together all the suggestions and present them as a community suggestion box, so to speak. Let's see how it develops....



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04 Jan 2013 16:46 by johnzx Star rating in Spain. 5247 posts Send private message

 Thanks Mac, I am sure that many will be pleased to hear your helpful offer.

 
Could  I ask that you send a suggestion now that there should be a facility on the site to allow  those with NIEs and maybe for non-Spanish speakers, who after all do provide substantial income  to the economy (even more so at present) to be able to present ideas ?
 
Thanks John
 
PS Ian, I was typing my post when you posted. Maybe you too could try to widen the acceptance facility for suggestions ?

 

 


This message was last edited by johnzx on 04/01/2013.



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04 Jan 2013 17:09 by mac75 Star rating in Valencia. 409 posts Send private message

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 Sure no problem, but if Ian would rather tie all the suggestions togther and present them in one go that might not be such a bad idea, I'll happily pass him the baton! so to speak... after all he started the thread!!

 


This message was last edited by mac75 on 04/01/2013.

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04 Jan 2013 17:19 by eos_ian Star rating in Valencia. 496 posts Send private message

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 Absolutely, happy to do that as I said before. I will see how the suggestions go over the weekend and if the thread picks up I will pull together all the suggestions and present them , including your suggestion Johnzx, I've taken note. 

 



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05 Jan 2013 06:55 by watchmanager Star rating. 25 posts Send private message

A good forum subject but I would have thought the Spanish Government would be the ones to sort out their own red tape.

By this I mean that they don't really think they have any!

Instead of inundating them with suggestions on how to fix something they DON'T think they have - it might be an idea to compile a list of the actual redtape problems EOS members have undoubtedly been put through and then urge the Government to right their own wrongs. What do you think? This way it should be easier to see which are the most common types.





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05 Jan 2013 07:20 by tenerifediver Star rating. 5 posts Send private message

 I have a suggestion that will help everybody, including the government.

Do something with the tax system! The current structure makes it almost impossible for companies to pay a decent salary on a full time contract. The result is the burgeoning black market where the tax man receives nada! It is so plainly obvious that a fairer tax system will achieve at least four things:

  • Bye bye black market (or it will be substantially reduced anyway).
  • Tax revenue will increase overnight
  • Employees will then be paying their rightful dues to the benefits system for health and pensions
  • Reducing employers' contributions will allow them to invest in their businesses = growth

And while they are sorting that out, do something with the ridiculous autonomo payments contributions! Up to é300 per month? Regardless of income?? What planet were they on when that was dreamed up? If anything encourages cash-in-hand work more than that, I'd like to hear it! 

Why not adopt something similar to the UK system for the self-employed?

  • They keep records.
  • They submit tax returns.
  • They pay tax on profits anually.
  • They are less compelled to "dodge the system"
  • In a poor month, they are not forking out é300 for gains they have not made!
  • So, so simple!

Again, this will encourage more individuals to join the system legitamately, the taxman will know who you are, what you do and will receive a FAIR tax payment from you annually.

The Spanish tax system is similar in many respects to that in Greece - and look what is happening there!

Is it really beyond the wit of Man to do something about this chaotic system that heammorages much needed revenue from goverment coffers?

I am about to move to Almeria.....but am hesitating, due to this minefield of income tax and employment status!

I wonder what others think?

Happy new year to all anyway!

 


This message was last edited by tenerifediver on 05/01/2013.



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05 Jan 2013 08:02 by 66d35 Star rating. 243 posts Send private message

They could make a good start by abolishing the ludicrous, time-wasting "registration" procedures for new residents of EU origion that involve people making multiple trips (hundreds of km in some cases), for no real purpose whatsoever. Most other countries do not do this, a few do it, but make the process very simple - Spain does it and makes it as complex and difficult as possible. It achieves  absolutely nothing of any use. If they do want to do it, at least simplfy it and reduce the travel involved. It coud easily be done online. It would be preferable to get rid of it altogether for EU citizens. A more pointless, costly and time-wasting piece of red tape it would be hard to devise.





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05 Jan 2013 08:06 by midasgold Star rating in Mijas.. 91 posts Send private message

Don't forget to put your suggestion to the Spanish Government in triplicate !



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05 Jan 2013 08:40 by tenerifediver Star rating. 5 posts Send private message

 Hi Midasgold.

Ok.....got a link?





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05 Jan 2013 09:15 by morley Star rating. 0 posts

The problem with one person taking on other peoples suggestions is that it will appear that only one person has that suggestion! & it obviously it would be better for as many people as possible to make suggestions. I looked & it does not appear that you need an NIE just know what capital of Spain is!





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05 Jan 2013 09:20 by jonoflordevida Star rating. 2 posts Send private message

 Having had 10 year´s of experience dealing with the authorities, burocrats and all aspects of running a business here I welcome a considered change in duplicate processes and the rediculous procedures that remain in place so many years after El Caudillo departed. I concurr that the autonomo situation and employee NI rates are too high for small businesses to support especially in these times of austerity. This needs to be attended urgently. Having made several trips to the Seguridad Social office in Lorca to sort out what I consider to be a simple matter the funcionarios there have made it almost impossible. The attempts at requiring everyone to have a digital certificate and use the SS webpage to administer their payments have failed !

 

The fact that we cannot place a comment on the suggestions site worries me. Does this illustrate that we have no voice in Spain? 

 

Wihin this forum it would be impossible to list all of the obvious faults with burocratic processes here. So for me, the main core problems to address are the lack of accountability for individuals, security of work tenure(they cannot be sacked), poor training and lack of work ethic.

I have attached a hilarious video which basically sums it up!! Enjoy


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESBljU-LzeU



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05 Jan 2013 09:31 by 66d35 Star rating. 243 posts Send private message

The fact that they have millions of foreign residents here from all over Europe, we can pay taxes, but not even leave a comment because their site will not accept an NIE number is ridiculous - and speaks volumes.

 

 





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05 Jan 2013 10:24 by jools50 Star rating. 1 posts Send private message

 I have lived here for almost 9 years and I run a business with my Spanish business partner. We both pay almost 300 a month for autonomo and it is crippling us, as well as 100 a month for the gestor to do paperwork, then not to mention normal overheads.

Although I speak reasonable Spanish, anything official has to be done by my partner because nobody here has a basic command of English. ie Telefonica, Endesa, local authorities etc

Having just spent 3 weeks in Oman in the middle east, they leave Spain standing on the spot as far as integration goes.

Every road sign is in Arabic and English. Everybody who works with the general public speak an excellent level of English.

I went there because my Son is in the military and working for the Sultan there, he and his Wife had my first Grandchild, hence my visit.

During my visit my Son had issues with their telephone and Internet connection, which was sorted on the Islamic sabbath.......unbelievable!

Shops are open 7 days a week (Spain is losing huge ammounts of income and job creation by closing on Sundays)

Another thing which amazed me is that many foreign companies like Marks & Spencers, Next, Matalan, and even the French supermarket Carrefour are all over the place there.............and yet Oman has a total population of 2.7 million people, but they must be doing something right.

Rajoy should be asking himself why these companies dont want to invest in Spain, which has a huge ex-pat community who will spend their money here if they get the opportunity, instead of buying rubbish from the Chinese bazaars which seem to be cropping up all over the place.

Keep the money in Europe, then maybe, just maybe, we will see a way out of this recession

.

 

 

 

 





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