The spring 2009 EGM

 Hi all,

 The official Spanish agenda for the EGM:

Message from a boardmember.

The only one who can give an agenda is the President

Max  its sad to see that minutes before the official agenda you try to provocate here.

You only can give the topics and  we will make the agenda including the topics of the "25%" of the people in addition of our topics!!

Another point of my concern is that the agenda is made by you and we spoke to many people who signed for the EGM not aware of the points you claim here.

Anyway we are polite people and all these topics will be handeled although your topics are not  determined by full democracy

This agenda is not valid!!!

I will ask people to hold their proxies for the official anouncement

And ofcourse its up to you who you will give your proxy but even better to be there yourself

More information this afternoon

Best regards,

René

Here are my answers to points 1 to 9, what do you all think, agree or disagree.

1. Cleaning service. Current situation/termination of the contract with Hervás and clarification of point 4 section of the minutes from the General meeting 8 november 2008. Vote to rehire the services of Hervás.

Answer 1 ) There were complaints last year regarding the cleaning when the previous committee were running the community.

2. Revision and current state of the budget 2009.

Answer 2 ) Not applicable for comparison of last years committee.

3. Security in the Urbanisation.

Answer 3 ) My personal opinion is there is security at the entrance of Don Juan that covers Phases 2 and 3. I think this is a sufficient detterant and a good way to reduce our costs during these economic difficulties. Once the economy has recovered, I would be willing to employ security, or consider it once phase 3 is completed.

4. Current situation of the swimming pools in the complex.

Answer 4 ) Same problem with phase 1 pools last year when the previous committee were running the community. Phase 2 pool is out of our control.

5. Exploitation and use of the water reservoir.

Answer 5 ) Not applicable to last year.

6. Mail.

Answer 6 ) Same problem with mail last year when the previous committee were running the community.

7. Access to the complex.

Answer 7 ) Same problem with access to the development last year when the previous committee were running the community. It seems Renfe are not interested.

8. Telephone line.

Answer 8 ) Same problem with telephone lines last year when the previous committee were running the community.

9. Vote for a next meeting in september 2009, to see if a revision of the budget is in order and analyse the progress that has been realised after the meeting that we are calling now.

Answer 9 ) Not applicable to last year.

I think my overall judgement of this is maybe we need a bit more communication, say a monthly email. Can we prepare a list of email addresses for all of the owners, is this possible. It would save a lot of money in postage etc and keep most owners happy.

Regarding the committee, most of the problems we have today are no different to the same problems as last year. I think the way things work in Spain a lot of the time, takes time. It's like dragging your feet through mud. It must be so frustrating. You must feel like banging your head off a wall. I am sure Max would agree, as he was on the committee last year. I think the last thing the committee needs is constant nagging. Remember they are doing this for free and in their own time. They are doing this for the benefit of all of us. It must get so demoralising. Just remember they could all walk away. Who would be willing to do the job then. Maybe we could have Perla for President :-)

Message from the board,

Please find attached the official Agenda

Covering all topics requested by the owners who have called the meeting and some points added by the community board to explain the current status.

Hope to see you the 2nd of May

If not please leave your proxy vote to who you want with the explanation how you feel about the topics.

Now more than ever it is important to let hear your voice!!

Best regards,

René

Fuengirola 2009, july 6th.

    ( CONVOKING NEIGHBORS AND THE REQUEST IN DARK) to summon To an EXTRAORDINARY GENERAL MEETING, that will  take place in Paris Room of FLATOTEL, may 2nd, 2008 at 10:30 for the first call shall commence and for the second at 11:00 with the following:

 AGENDA:

1.         Last Minute Reading.

2.         Report of the Board of Community.

3.         According the Art. 16.2 LPH and the convoking neighbours: MAILBOXES.

The Board explain the situation. The installation of mailboxes in Sierra de Cazorla Street (budget estimated 18,000 euros) Approval of budget and extraordinary fee.

4.         According the Art. 16.2 LPH and the convoking neighbours: Access to the Development and telephone line.

The Board explain the situation.

5.         Acccording the  Art. 16.2 LPH and the convoking neighbours: Accounts balance 2009.

6.         According the  Art. 16.2 LPH and the convoking neighbours: Security in the Community.

The Board explain the situation.

7.         According the  Art. 16.2 LPH and the convoking neighbours: Swimming pools of don Juan. Use of rain tank.

The Board explain the situation.

8.         According the  Art. 16.2 LPH and the convoking neighbours: Service of cleanning (present situation/rescission of the contract and resolve doubts about the point 4.b) of the Minute of the Annual General meeting celebrated 8 of november 2008. they propose to continuity the contract by Limpiezas Hervas SL.

9.         Several subjects, requests and questions.According the  Art. 16.2 LPH and the convoking neighbors: next meeting september 2009 for review the situation.

   We request,due to  the importance of the subjects to be decided,yours attendance or,that you appoint by a third partyto represent you  in the Meeting, filling up the form that appears on foot of page.

Note: To the originating neighbours, it is pointed out that the proprietors whose community fees are not up to date on  the day of the Meeting will not be able to  vote, according to article 15,2 of the Law of Horizontal Property

 "-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

AUTORIZACIÓN.D._________________________________________________________como propietario del inmueble / Owner of the house ___________________ Sito en Residencial Don Juan Fase 1 /of Residencial Don Juan.  A través del presente escrito concede autorización a / I grant to authorization to D.____________________________________________________________________ para la asistencia y votación en la Junta de esta comunidad, a celebrar el día  2 mayo de 2009 / for the attendance and voting in the May 2nd. 2009, Meeting.

This message was last edited by Rene35 on 4/7/2009.

This message was last edited by Rene35 on 4/7/2009.

This message was last edited by Rene35 on 4/7/2009.

Dear Carol

Comparing me with Franco gives some respect do you think?

Anyway to come back onto  the Agenda.

The procedure is that the people who call the meeting deliver the points to be dicussed to the board.

Then the board can decide to add some points and to make the agenda suitable for a perfect meeting.

You can check on all the points in Max his agenda, they are in here

I don't see any problem also legally not in this agenda, all the points will be handled with care.

Dear René,

I don´t compare you with Franco.

Only that is typical, trying to distract people as possible to discuss a matter that is difficult for you.

You know that the order is important, so what has changed and not for the sake of the meeting, but for his own good. If not, why has it changed? You will first seek to justify your "wonderful" performance, saying "good" that are ultimately flatter to try to gloss over the issues, and leave for the final issues that bother you and hope that the neighbors are tired and complain it loss possible.

But Sir, once again think that the neighbors are fools, and with this change of order to insult back, but the neighbors are ready and know all you do it.

So difficult is to respect the desire of the neighbors?

Carol12

It is very difficult not to get personal about you. You are quite happy to hide behind a veil and act like a paper tiger despite repeated requests for you to identity yourself, even if it is only by your block or apartment.

You have been downright rude towards the members of the committee and I am amazed that Rene still gives you the time of day. You won't put up and you won't shut up - to date only one person claims to know who you really are - nod, nod, wink,wink!!!!

Either you like playing silly games or you really have something to be ashamed of.

 Rene,

Could you edit your post to protect the privacy of people. It's not done to publicise names and apartment numbers on a public forum.

Max

Hi all

I see Carol 12 is worried about us neighbours paying for any lawsuits if they happen. Well maybe we might be able to pay these if a number of those that have voted for this EGM had paid up to date with their community fees( see debtors list, dated 7th April 2009 ).

Here are a few examples of how much is owed by some of the people that apparantly now have the right to vote and are now showing an interest in what goes on in the community. It's a shame that cannot show a bit more interest in their outstanding community fees first. Here are half a dozen of the outstanding amounts owed.

€  1, 865.37

€   646.17

€   814.72

€   381.18

€   696.86

€ 1, 756.44

What a great example this is setting for everyone. It doesn't matter if you owe money, we won't bother paying, we still get a vote. Not to worry, all the other mugs who have paid up to date will cover the cost. What a joke.

 Hi Westport,

People with serious debts are not allowed to vote.

Max

Having to pay legal fees to recover unpaid community fees through the courts will be one expense the fee-paying and reasonable members of the community will be willing to pay for.

The debtors are using the EGM as a diversionary tactic - less time avaliable to be spent on managing and collecting the monies due.

Hi Max

I am glad to hear that people with serious debts are not allowed to vote. What do you class as serious debt, as two of the voters owe € 1,865.37 and € 1,756.44. Is it anyone over € 1,900.00.  I think it should be if you owe 1 cent you should not be able to vote on any issue. I am sure they have plenty of time to get in contact with the administrator to clear their debt if they feel that strongly before voting on an issue. Instead of the question being put to the committee regarding security for Phase 1, lets ask these 6 people first. Maybe they think security comes free these days. This is the one point that annoys me more than any other. I am up to date with my payments, so are you. Why should we pay for their comforts when at Don Juan. It's a bit like me buying a car and they drive it.

Westport

Empty words Jenx. On the last AGM you were yourself on the list of debtors which were not allowed to vote. Let's stick to facts:

We have about 15-16% owners who are in debt, On the list of people requesting the EGM it is ony 11% so on average these people are better payers than the people who didn't sign.

Max

how many of the 15-16% debtors  belong to Arrohabotatge?

Max you stated in an earlier post that people should not vote without knowing all facts. Did you make sure that the people who signed the request and might give you a proxy are paying enough attention to care about the facts.

This seems quite strange to me that you use your contacts to achieve signatures from people who have never bothered to pay comunityfee.

This message was last edited by solgre on 4/7/2009.

 Hi Solgre,

None, we avoided asking for Arrohabitatges votes as we don't consider them real members of the community. (edit I misread your question. Arrohabitatge is counted as one of the debtors so they hardly add to the total I counted on the list).

On your other question: yes I made sure people were fully aware of the facts. We even refused a signature because the guy did obviously have no clue about the communal issues although he wanted to sign. I have personally never accepted  signatures from people who where in debt but of course I was only aware of the public lists. For privacy reasons I don't have access to the complete list of debtors (which to me is the correct way).

Max 

 Hi all,

Max is calling the €18000 fee for postal services a presumption so his scaremongering people into thinking we are facing a €8000 law suit when in fact a law suit hasn't even been taken out, so is this not also a presumption? So its ok for him to go round scaring people into thinking that we are facing a €8000 bill but its not ok for the committee to give us the hard facts about other costs!!

 Hi Westport,

I overlooked your last post. Sorry for that.

I call everyone who is behind three months or longer a serious debtor who should never be allowed to vote. If people miss one one or two payments but normally pay on schedule I would give them the benefit of the doubt. Of course it's not up to me to decide that but it seems like a reasonable rule to me.

Jenx made clear by PM to me that there are sometimes reasons why debts (in her case) are even higher but I disagree with that point of view. If you have a disagreement about specific payments or whatever in my view you should always pay up to at least the amount you think is right. Some of the debtors on the current list dispute their bills. I can't judge that, but I would say that as a owner in this community the least you can do is make sure that you pay up. I totally agree with you that real debtors can't demand services they don't pay for.  

Max