Ending a Business in Spain

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Almanzora Country Club forum threads
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16 Jun 2008 12:00 AM by johnfozard Star rating. 143 forum posts Send private message

Channel 4 are asking me for evidence to back up our claims - can you please send me PM's only in answer to the following questions ...

(I need as many replies as poss - to show the extent of the issue - naturally they are expecting us to provide evidence of the numbers involved) - so I need as many to reply as poss.

1. Can everyone send me a PM of the amounts they are owed and from when. This is very important to prove we have been ripped off for tens of millions - not just millions!

2. If you have not received a BG on any installment - tell me for how much and when paid.

3. If you have received a bounced cheque from Huma - when was it and how much?

4. How many people/solicitors have contacted Huma and been refused a cancellation form?

5. How many people/solicitors have been promised a refund and it never came?



THIS IS THE NEAREST WE HAVE GOT TO EXPOSING THIS - PLEASE SUPPORT US 

I am sure I will need to ask you other questions  to satisfy the journalists - if we provide the evidence we stand a better chance!!

Please use PM's to contact me with any confidential info - I will respect all comments.

I will do my best for allof us as I am owed 100k Euros - so that is why I am willing to work hard on this to benefit us all - but also to save other Brits from making the same mistake with Parador/Huma.

John




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17 Jun 2008 9:55 AM by johnfozard Star rating. 143 forum posts Send private message

It has been alleged that the land for ACC was bought jointly thru Huma & Parador - companies or directors.

I assume the Land Register would show these details.

Can someone that has a good solicitor(if any) please ask them to find out urgently - what the Register says.

If it costs money - I will reimburse you.

If you have any info or can help on this please send it now!!!

PM ONLY PLEASE!!!

...............................................

ALSO READ MY POST BELOW AND REPLY - WE NEED EVIDENCE FOR CHANNEL4 OF THE AMOUNTS OWED AND FROM WHEN -  CHANNEL 4 NEWS ARE QUERYING THAT I THINK HUMA HAVE UP TO £34MILLION  OF OUR MONEY. I NEED TO TRY AND PROVE THIS WITH AS MUCH INFO AS POSS.


Send any info by PM




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17 Jun 2008 6:17 PM by trudge Star rating. 154 forum posts Send private message

Hi John here are our details 

PAID £2.000 ON 10TH JULY 2005 NO B/G WAS GIVEN ALTHOUGH KEPT ON FOR IT.

PAID £35,000 BEGINNING OF SEP 2005 STILL NO B/G, BEEN ASKING FOR IT NO JOY.

PROMISED REFUND AROUND ABOUT XMAS TWICE, IT  WAS ON ITS WAY NO JOY, THATS WHEN WE TOLD SOLICETOR TO START COURT PROCEEDINGS AS WE WERE WILLING TO JUST HAVE OUR MONEY BACK THAT WE HAD PAID.hope this helps good luck and well done thanks.

Trudy.


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19 Jun 2008 12:17 PM by johnfozard Star rating. 143 forum posts Send private message

I am trying to prove how much we are collectively been ripped off by Huma.

Please see my postings below and reply in confidence to me by PM.

We need to show Channel 4 News as much evidence as possible to presuade them to feature us.

Thanks for all the PM's so far.

John


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19 Jun 2008 12:17 PM by johnfozard Star rating. 143 forum posts Send private message

I am trying to prove how much we are collectively been ripped off by Huma.

Please see my postings below and reply in confidence to me by PM.

We need to show Channel 4 News as much evidence as possible to presuade them to feature us.

Thanks for all the PM's so far.

John


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19 Jun 2008 6:11 PM by trudge Star rating. 154 forum posts Send private message

Hi John and all  who reads this as you no i put my details for all to see, but i dont mind because people need to no how much they have of our money . What makes me feel sick is Andy from Villaquest who WAS our agent  (he dont want to no now ) showed us around the site the week before the building work had stopped ,he must of known there was problems and he didnt have the decency to tell us knowing how excited we were, and to think our friends almost put a depossit down for another property ,perhaps we should tell channel 4 this ,why should the agents be getting away with it ,also they were the ones who recommended our solicitor, bad mistake he probably new as well there was trouble yes lets menton them all sorry but ive had enough of it all.


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19 Jun 2008 8:31 PM by Philmel Star rating. 214 forum posts Send private message

Indeed, it shows there's was possibly an aweful amount of dishonesty and desception going on prior to the buiding work being stopped.
Although you would never prove it. All in the name of greed just to get hold of OUR hard earned cash by whatever means. I remember trying to contact the sales guy that took us around shortly after signing. (to be fair great chap and no presure) alas, he had disapeared into the darkness never to be seen again....

However, every dog has his day, and I'm more than happy to see any of these agents involved in this scam go out of business as the markets collapse and crash around them today.............

The only thing I have to say in favour of our agent is that they refunded our last stage payment very quickly with out any quibble just to get us off their back. Why, because they knew this case will get high profile.....and they didn't want to be part of it. Wise move because have no fear -  The ACC profile in the media spot light is just begining.




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23 Jun 2008 9:13 PM by LucasAsociados Star rating in Almeria. 124 forum posts Send private message

Dear John,

We are solicitors with an office in Vera and have some clients withdrawing contracts for Almanzora COuntry Club.

So, we know quite well the legal situation, and most of the possible cases occured.

If you want, just contact me and I'll give you all information you need for the CHannel 4 people.


Emilio Lucas


_______________________
E. Lucas Read my blog http://www.eyeonspain.com/blogs/lucasasociados.aspx


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24 Jun 2008 12:05 AM by ILostMySensaHuma Star rating. 87 forum posts Send private message

Dear Emilio

What possible information could you provide to Channel 4?

If you are offering to do this out of the goodness of your heart, please post said information on this forum.

If you do not post this information then I strongly suspect you are touting for business and should cease and desist forthwith.

I (along with many others) have invested a substantial amount of money in this project.

According to the Spanish codigo penal, I have been wronged because the developer never issued my bank guarantees AND never built my house in the timescale they contracted to.

Given that I am totally in the right and can't possibly lose my case, would you represent me in court on a no win no fee basis?

I strongly suspect not.

Will rant more if provoked but that's it for now.

This message was last edited by ILostMySensaHuma on 6/24/2008.


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24 Jun 2008 8:27 AM by Philmel Star rating. 214 forum posts Send private message

Hmm, what additional info could Mr Lucas possibly have we all don't already know and John doesn't already know.......

Who's side is he on ? Ours we would hope.




This message was last edited by Philmel on 6/24/2008.


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24 Jun 2008 10:36 AM by LucasAsociados Star rating in Almeria. 124 forum posts Send private message

Dear LostMySensaHuma,

No hidden intentions on my post. I'm just offering this people a legal view on the matter and all the information I have.

Some of this information is public reports from Administrations, anyone can access to, but I can help them in the interpretation. Other information is just how to afford the situation from our point of view in the different cases we have (guarantee, no guarantee, timed-out guarantee, etc.), and our experience on how the things are running.  And, of course there's some additional extraofficial information not to be posted here, and to be given "mouth to ear".

One more thing... did you know the "Abogado del Estado" (Public Attorney) was rejected last Thursday for the votation on the Urban Plan of Cuevas in the "Comisión Provincial de Urbanismo" (Provincial Urban Commission) because of suspected relationships with Huma (part of the proposal was legalising ACC)??? And did you know there's a curious letter around some administrations and legal operators about this an other things??? All these are the things I can't post.

About the guarantees, there's a specific fine for the developers of 25% of the amount not guaranteed, but we think that what our clients want first is getting their money back, so we are not interested on Huma to be fined since we've recovered our clients' monies. But, of course, it's a way we've never refused to take, as we also consider criminal actions and managers liability actions.

Of course, if you want the information, you can also call me and I'll give it to you. Just understand that we can't post all the information.

About your case, here's my challenge: I accept your case no win no fees. Just tell me when we can meet.

Emilio Lucas



_______________________
E. Lucas Read my blog http://www.eyeonspain.com/blogs/lucasasociados.aspx


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24 Jun 2008 10:39 AM by LucasAsociados Star rating in Almeria. 124 forum posts Send private message

Dear Philmel,

I don't know what John knows or not.

I'm just offering the information I have, my experience and my legal point of view.

Just tell you the same as to LostMySensaHuma.

And, of course, I'm on the side of the buyers, as I have some clients who bought in ACC (not under our advisory) and that have come to us to get a solution for them.

We work for buyers. And that's our side on the barricades.

Emilio Lucas

_______________________
E. Lucas Read my blog http://www.eyeonspain.com/blogs/lucasasociados.aspx


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24 Jun 2008 11:29 AM by johnfozard Star rating. 143 forum posts Send private message

Emilio 

I thank you for your support - you are one of the few solicitors that have taken the trouble to write to us and offer help.

I hope you are not offended by us.

I applaude you.

The problem is we are all touchy here now - after so many people offering false news and trying to sell their services over the years. We all need our money back!!

Plus we are all very suspicious of anyone spanish - I know that is awful to say - but we have to say it !

What a terrible world we live in - when we worry about all and everyone's motives!!!

John


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24 Jun 2008 11:57 AM by LucasAsociados Star rating in Almeria. 124 forum posts Send private message

Dear johnfozard,

I know there's som many people that have been real "crooks" for British people coming and that you have lots of reasons to be suspicious.

It's been so pretty and easy business that all sharks went quickly. We should have never advise to sign ACC contract, but others did..

In any case, I think the buyers must be in contact and share there experiences and results. 

And that's why I offer you to share information, experience and help.

By the way, can't access private messages. Will answer as soon I'm able to.



_______________________
E. Lucas Read my blog http://www.eyeonspain.com/blogs/lucasasociados.aspx


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24 Jun 2008 12:16 PM by johnfozard Star rating. 143 forum posts Send private message

24 Jun 2008 4:39 PM by daviessolicitors Star rating. 12 forum posts Send private message

One of the reasons so many people are affected by the Country Club. 

This article is meant to be a general guideline . It is not written with any particular solicitor/barrister in mind.

Most clients used solicitors recommended by the builders or agents who where in turn charged rates much lower than the established solcitors in the are. 

In Jannuary of 2007 I plublished the article below  "cost of indpendance" in one of the local papers. The essence of the article is that good legal and independant advice needs to be paid for , and to expect a solicitor to charge for his time even if he has to recommend you do not  purchase

We told every single client that came to our office (withought exception) NOT to purchase on that complex, as their was no building licence for the complex, and tha builder did not hold title deed to the land. 

The reason I am saying all this is that  good advice (by barristers or solicitors) does NOT come cheap, but is neccesary  Clients who have purchased at the Country Club must not make the same mistake again. ,Good solicitors charge for their time , and in exchange you should expect to receive advice that is thecnically correct, honest and independant. 

When choosing a solicitor/barrister to handle your case  against HUMA , take into account the possible mistake allready made when choosing the solicitor to handle your conveyance. 

IN A NUTSHELL: If you have purchased at COUNTRY CLUB and have bank guarantees, hire a solicitor/barrister to get your money back. (YOU MUST NOT LET THE BANK GUARANTEES ELAPSE). If you have not got bank guarantees, we recommend you hire a barrister to innitiate your case as soon as possible.



The article published in jannuary 2007 was: 

LEGAL CORNER:
By Michael Davies .
Abogado/Solicitor.
 
If you wish us to print an article about a particular topic, please e-mail davies1@telefonica.net
 
 
PURCHASE OF SPANISH PROPERTY:INDEPENDANT INFORMATION WILL HELP SOLUTION MOST OF THE PROBLEMS THAT PURCHASERS COME ACROSS.
 
Last week Mr. Mark Sucklin who writes the Spanish Property Doctor Column for the Sunday Times was in Almeria to gather information for his column.
 
We had lunch together and I have to say he is full of knoledge about the legalities of the purchase of property in Spain . He also  has a very complete overall picture of how the property market in Spain works for a large percentage of the British purchasers and why some purchasers get themselves into so much trouble.
 
The main problem is the source of information for the majority of purchasers. This source of informatio in general is the selling agent or builder. This is wrong as the buyers need to receive independant and sound legal advice from a solicitor that has no incentive from pleasing the builder.
 
In most of the cases the solicitor recommended by the builder will be 100% independant and will have all the correct knoledge, but not always.
 
It is essential that a solicitor has the absolute freedom to confront the builder if need be. In what is now a very competitive market (the legal profesion) absolute independance is an expensive luxury for a solicitor, because in general  with English buyers estate agents and builder have the first contact with purchasers and it is very easy for them to direct a majority of the purchasers to the solicitor of their choice.
 
For a solicitor receiving 80 out of 100 conveyances on a single project it is easy to be very cheap and still make loads of money, but independance to confront the builder in this scenario must be difficult.
 
People like Mr. Mark Stucklin with his column in the Sunday Times will continue to recommend purchasers to seek independant legal advice before they purchase and to avoid using the solicitor recommended by the builder, but in the meantime we recommend that at least you purchase a book about purchasing property in Spain, and that you insist that the practice should be exactly the same as the theory. We are tired of situations where clients come in to see us with a major problem that originated in the builder telling them when confronted with something as logical as whanting to have their bank guarantee certificates on their stage payments that Spain is different and that in practice this does not happen even though this is in all the books. Bank guarantees on stage payments are obligotory and have been since 1964, but they cost the builder money and if the client or his solicitor does not ask for them sometimes the client does not get them. (this is an typical example ,but their are many more).
 
Mr. Mark Stuckling will be writing about bank guarantees next Sunday. We hope many people read his column every week , as it is independant advice full of knoledge and common sense. 
 
In the meantime we agree that , SPAIN IS DIFERENT and we like it this way , but this should affect purchasers guarantees when buying property in Spain.
 
Michael Davies.
Abogado.
 
 
Michael Davies is a Spanish Abogado and his firm DAVIES SOLICITORS (established 1992)is one of the leading firms of solicitors in Almeria. 
 
Member 1748 of Almeria Law Society.
Member 67228 of Madrid Law Society.
Member 2424 of the Probate Section of the British Law Society
 



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24 Jun 2008 5:38 PM by Antojo Star rating. 101 forum posts Send private message

Michael,

We understand and appreciate what you are saying. However, I'm sure that some buyers on ACC will be in the same position as we are. If I can explain ;

We thought carefully prior to looking for a property in Spain. We wanted a small holiday home, we were not looking to make money.

We did not, at that time have internet access, or indeed the knowledge of using it!!  So, we thought that the safest way to buy would be through a large reputable agent who arranged an inspection trip from the UK. Their brochure promised a ' safe and easy purchase procedure' guided by their 'experts'.

Our agent told us that  ' we never recommend a solicitor working with our company. I will recommend an independant solicitor for you, everything  at ACC is legal, all of the papers are in place.'   'I can guarantee that all is legal, many sites are not'.

Having spent 4 days with this person, he had gained our trust, we valued his advice. He assured us that nothing can go wrong.
He was 'protecting us ' from people who sell properties out of the boot of their car ! After all, his  'son has bought on ACC as an investment ! ' 

We visited his  'independant solicitor ' who assured us that she had no connection with Huma. She told us that she had made a thorough check on the licences and all of the papers were in order.

Needless to say we were shocked to discover a year later that this lawyer was working for Huma. Our agent never communicated with us again, in fact their office disappeared from Mojacar. 

So, yes we have learned a valuable lesson, hindsight is a great thing.  

At the end of the day we are normal people, we  trusted advice from large organisations. Agents, developers and lawyers have all lied to us for the same reason  --- greed. Now even greedier lawyers are on our case to make even more money out of us. We were lied to by another 2 lawyers, and still haven't got our money back, despite having a bank guarantee. 

The banks are a law unto themselves, who regulates these people ? What makes them think that they can keep our money without even giving a reason? 

Yes we have changed,  we trust no-one , how sad. We read similar stories on property forums and hope that prospective buyers read and take note . We hope that other people with the benefit of information boycott these agents and they all go out of business, which is all that they deserve. 




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24 Jun 2008 6:57 PM by alfie Star rating. 44 forum posts Send private message

Hi john

Just thought I would send this e-mail to say thanks for al your help, Im just glad your on our side and not Huma`s your doing a brilliant job.  Also I would like to thank Lucas Asociados and Micheal Davies for their help. Things seem to be hotting up a little. Thanks again.

Alfie


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24 Jun 2008 7:37 PM by AndyLynnW Star rating. 142 forum posts Send private message

Hi John, we will provide details of how much we are owed and the bounced cheque. At last somone taking a stand and not saying "buy at Oasis because im an agent and I know, you will be safeguarding your money"


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24 Jun 2008 9:24 PM by trudge Star rating. 154 forum posts Send private message

Hi John and all those who are trying to help us we really appreciate it and fair play to the solicitors on here too
 It comes to something when they recognise their own country and people are  ripping us off , its a shame the people who have done this to us don't have a conscience, it just amazes me how they can get away with it ,and for so long .
 what makes it worse for those who don't have a B/G have to fight and pay out more even though its against Spanish law not to issue one, it beats me ,but is there really any law out there, don't seem like it. 

I really hope the agents that has put us through all this, read  the  forum, which i know they do , have sleepless nights wondering if they are going to get paid  after all this has come out in the open ,and then they 'll no what its like to worry ,you don't see them on here trying to fend for them selves because they no they have cocked up big time,but just remember whilst your sat in the sun supping your cocktails on your roof terrace like we should of been in July 2006 with all our new furniture we bought what goes around comes around.
But a big thank you for all those trying to help.

 




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