Mac's Poll - Let's Vote

Curious to know what the general opinion is? Cast your vote and let's see!!

POLL : Will Spain's cost of living still be attractive if the UK leaves the EU?
Thursday, June 2, 2016 @ 1:14 PM

DOUBLE POLL

FIRSTLY:

When it comes to retirement and even part-year living in a foreign country the cost of living is the determining factor most of the time. People compare everything from a tin of beans to an apartment on the beach and a three course meal. Some think Spain isn't what it used to be and others find it considerably cheaper than the UK still. I thought it might be interesting to get a general more up to date feel for this subject amongst the EOS members. So does Spain still offer a low cost of living or has it become more expensive, to such a point that it isn't that attractive anymore?

SECONDLY:

If so, do you think it will be just as attractive if the UK was to leave the EU?

The pound has slumped to a seven-year low against the dollar after David Cameron fired the starting gun on a four-month battle to determine the UK’s future in Europe. Ratings agency Moody’s has also warned that Britain’s strong credit score would be at risk if the public vote to leave the EU.

On financial markets, investors are gearing up for choppy trading between now and the 23 June vote. Investors are worried about the UK’s economic prospects if it leaves the EU and so they are more reluctant to hold sterling-denominated assets. Even before the referendum outcome is known the economy could suffer, say economists. Businesses do not like uncertainty and so exports, investment and overall growth could all be hampered, they say. Economists are not unanimous about a Brexit being negative for the economy, with some making the point that the UK could end up better off in the long term....

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32 Comments

Falcón said:
Thursday, June 2, 2016 @ 5:32 PM

I think that the life in Spain always has been attractive. In Spain there are lot of things that attract all people. Such as the segurity for the street, medicine, weather, food...etc.
Spain is a country very advanced however some spanish critical it own country and they don't know that there are things worse outside.
I think than UK shouldn't go UE, because it do everythings country stronger.
All country UE together.

cuius said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 7:41 AM

Difficult to give a definitive answer until there is a clear statement about the affects of "Brexit" on pensions and healthcare. if any

Hugh said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 8:05 AM

UK should remain within the EU
Benefits of remaining in the EU for the ordinary UK man and woman are mostly determined by the impact a vote to leave will have on the British economy : a fall in sterling exchange against Euro and other major currencies will impact on the purchase power for UK citizens abroad. The fall in recent exchange rates for sterling indicates a worrying sign of such a leave EU vote.
Ease of travel within the EU is also a major benefit: I travel regularly into San javier airport and the swift processing of the EU visitor on arrival should make the uncertain voter think to remain within the EU as the most sensible way to vote.
EU Border points of entry for the UK citizen will certainly be different. This different will certainly be longer!
Vote remain in EU

expatdee said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 8:32 AM

Good grief, Are you serious Hugh, your one reason to stay within the EU is so you can get in and out of an airport quickly. What absolute and utter nonsense. I sincerely hope that all other English expats have a better understanding of how badly being within the Eu is affecting the UK and Spain than you have and how so much better off both countries will be if we vote OUT .

Phil said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 9:03 AM

What a load of rubbish they all talk. Nobody knows or can foresee what effect leaving the EU would have on the UK. Good or bad it is a unknown factor where as staying in is known and over time can be improved on if the will to make it work becomes part of our politicians ethos.

Phil said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 9:05 AM

What a load of rubbish they all talk. Nobody knows or can foresee what effect leaving the EU would have on the UK. Good or bad it is a unknown factor where as staying in is known and over time can be improved on if the will to make it work becomes part of our politicians ethos.

Paul W said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 9:07 AM

It is so very apparent when watching the news and reading so many self serving articles that the alternative to the status quo is not fully known. Really! A child could say this. 2 points to me are most important. For every £ traded by the UK there is a similar amount that goes the other way. So, if we leave and it gets complicated the other countries will just cancel things and not bother? Rubbish! There is a lot to sort, yes, but that is what the word "trade" is about. Bargaining comprising and agreeing. Sort it over time. We have done it for years. 2. What about being dictated to by faceless officials? Human rights for convicted murders etc etc. Sovereignty is important not just now but in the future.
Stand up for what you believe stop hiding and counting pennies (and euros). Vote leave.

briando55 said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 9:23 AM

I think the post was asking about how attractive it will be in terms of cost and value for money Spain would be if UK left the EU. I do get a little fed up of the same comments coming up about the top end effects, which lets face it are effects we all know little about.

So to get back to the post questions as I understand them.

Is there anyone who can give any insight into an opinion of how leaving the EU would effect the standard life of people 'on the ground'.

I think the airport comment was significant in that case, as would be the effect on borders. Maybe how much a tin of beans etc will cost will be worth debating too!!!!

Michael Richards said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 9:24 AM

Just one question,if we weren't in the EU now would we join now knowing about all the corruption etc.

Adrian said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 9:27 AM

The politicians for remain keep saying the they have won the economic argument. They use the IMF the bank of England the London school of economics the treasury department and other established economic think tanks to back up thier argument. The same people who the government rubbish when they criticis them and the same people who could not predict the financial crash in 2008. How could they possibly know how the UK would perform out of the EU? The remain campaign has spent tax payers money to back up their argument and when you see BBC news it may as well be a stay campaign political broadcast! They are doing everything the can to scare the population into a yes vote. We have a deficit with Europe does anyone really think that Spain will stop trading with us if we leave? Of course not. We will negotiate with Europe and be better off out with out the cost of having to abide by silly regulations and laws that restrain us from expanding in the world. VOTE LEAVE

Watchmanager said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 9:36 AM

Just THINK about it.
At the moment if we (GB) want anything then it is a vote between us and 27 other EU countries delegates.
Do the maths - 27 other, non elected groups, deciding to vote against us as they do now.
If we leave and we don't like what OUR government is doing then WE can decide to get rid of them EVERY FOUR YEARS!
If we stay and we don't like what THEIR non elected bureaucrats do then we have no way of getting rid of them EVER!
The EU is now not what it was meant to be. It is too big and UNCONTROLLABLE!
We need to, and have to, vote 'OUT'!

Paul W said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 9:38 AM

Its a double question so perhaps looking at just the headline rather than the detail is a flaw of too many casting votes just to save time in the airport. Extra time to shop about for your tin is beans. Cheapest price is not the only factor and you may find that to your cost when you don't like what is in the tin

Nels said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 9:48 AM

When we talk of democracy and the need to be able to elect our representatives, lets not forget that the present UK government was elected with a little over 20% of the votes cast !! Unless my maths are wrong, that means approx 80% of the people are not represented?

MANXMONKEY said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 10:01 AM

The EU has decimated the manufacturing, fishing and agricultural industries. Fact. The EU strangle some industries deliberately by paying farmers to cut down orchards in Hereford to protect the apple farmer in Hornfleur. They planned the demise of the dairy farming industry and obviously the fishing industry less generously which is why Cornwall and Whitby are papered with Vote Leave posters. So these are known facts. Exporting anywhere in the world is easy. You need a competitive product! I've exported to America and Canada ( no EU trade agreement in place) for 40 years. Same for dozens of other countries. The initial problem is the EU paperwork, not that of Israel or Australia. Free from the shackles of EU the UK will definitely export more. Remember we export way less to EU (and shrinking year on year) than we import so in the "at least two years" transition period we'll also negotiate to keep that market. No way is Germany or France going to risk losing it's biggest market for so many products. Pound value...well be quick to earn a fortune on the fx market because the major currency people predict an immediate decline in Sterling but not for long as free of EU the pound will be seen as a safe haven fiat currency, especially with Saudi Arabia's US problems threatening the Petro Dollar.

Eddie Wright said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 10:27 AM

I will just keep it simple, we have always been a strong nation,as others have found out to their cost, yes, it will be tough for a time,
but the rest of Europe, except MAYBE Germany, know who to trust,
after all most of them have had the benefit of some help from us.
So, come on Brits, LEAVE, get back to what we once were,without
interference from "strangers", you will have worked how I will vote.

Harddunby said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 10:36 AM

Brexit is not a leap into the unknown but returning to govern ourselves. 40% of UK laws now come from Brussels and are nodded through Parliament without discussion. The Civil Service are attracted to Brussels burocracy because they are no longer responsible. With currency exchange whether high or low never are any benefits felt short term. And that is the argument do we become yet another super state member and totally abdicate our sovereign control for very dubious short term planning. Add in the potential of 80 million Turks being able to come in and rampant Islam, it is going to be chaos by 2025.

Mutley51 said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 11:04 AM

MANXMONEY is absolutely right.

This is probably the most important decision the UK people have had to decide in modern history and the politicians are failing miserably in providing them with the facts to make an informed decision. It really is a disgrace that our Government attempts simply to frighten us into voting Remain and saying the UK would be unable to survive outside of the EU economically, financially and peacefully (i.e war and terrorism threats). If the Government actually believe this is true how on earth did Cameron lead us down this path to ruin and isolation. He is toast whatever the outcome. For hundreds of years we survived as an independent and self governing nation and would be able to do so again.
I think in the short term it will become more expensive for us who live in Spain as sterling is likely to move towards parity with the Euro but that will soon change the other way as the deep rooted problems of the Southern European countries worsen. Do not forget Greece, Portugal, Italy and yes Spain still have serious economic problems. If we were all honest leaving aside personal interests, LEAVING is in the best interests of the UK

Brian said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 12:02 PM

After having been in the E.U for 41 years now it would make more sense to stay and eventually reform it so that every country is happy. Whereas to leave would cause uncertainty because trade deals that are spoken about wouldn't just appear they would take time, therefore there would be economic uncertainty for quite a while.

Malcolm Whitney said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 1:04 PM

The remain camp can only see that there are financial risks in leaving whereas there are probably far greater risks in staying, and certainly in the long term. Consider just these few examples: the EU budget is set to increase because of the horrendous costs of the migration exercise, but it will not be declared until after the referendum. Do you know that quantitive easing has just had to be increased from 60 billion €'s to 70 billion €'s PER MONTH, to keep the whole EU afloat. Do you know that the top 5 cases of corruption in Spain alone add up to €10 BILLION, and that Spain is now moving into the position of the most corrupt country in the EU; do you know that there is a huge black hole with the pension funds for almost every country in the EU; and remember that the EU annual accounts are never declared. There is absolutely no control or monitoring of EU finances. It is a failed organisation propped up financially by printing money. It must collapse and we need to be well away from it.

Bernardo said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 1:08 PM

I've obviously read a different report from Moody's. In that report they suggest that there will be minimal effect on the UK economy, yes our credit rating may drop slightly but if the EU countries want to make life difficult by dragging their heals in trade negotiation talks their rating will fall more drastically. The EU economy as a whole is in a very poor position having to continuously support the failing euro. We will be better off in the long term deciding what is best for our country and how to spend our taxes.

dontim said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 1:36 PM

Moody's is one of the rating agencies that failed to rate the poor quality of sub-prime mortgages, and this led to the global 2007 crash. Don't trust anything they say.

You think the £ exchange rate will go down after Brexit but dont be too sure, The euro is the sick currency fundamentally, the debt woes of Portugal, Ireland, Spain, Italy and Greece are not going away soon, in fact they will get worse.

dontim said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 1:39 PM

One of the other effects of Brexit apparently might be a stalling of house price inflation in the UK, if not a decline. For many people - first time buyers and ex-pats who want to go home for example - this is to be welcomed.

nat-lads-dad said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 2:02 PM

The CEO of Airbus has said that they would not be in the UK if we were not in the EU. There are 1,000's of jods making Airbus wings and Typhoon / Eurofighter that depend on us being in Europe.

The bogus point put forward is that the Germans need access to our market more that vice versa. We do not need the EU market to trade with Europe, this will happen either way, although there will probably be trade tariffs. This is the distraction. We need to be part of a strong Europe not to trade within it but to defend our trade deals with USA, China, etc.

The USA is over 3 times bigger than us, they have shafted us at every opportunity. They squashed De Havilland (worlds first jet), they tried to kill Concorde and they have tried to stop Airbus by suing them at every opportunity.

Not just aircraft, try buying Vimto or haggis in the USA. Look what Nike have done to our sports companies, Slazenger, Dunlop, Mitre, Umbro, etc. The Germans might be big enough to stand up to the US but we, unfortunately, are not.

Bottom line, we will lose 15,000 Airbus jobs if the UK comes out of The EU. There could be similar job losses on Eurofighter, not to mention the car industry. Swiss banks had to create HQ's in London... Up to 500,000 jobs at risk!

The cost of running the EU parliament is cheap, about the same as a city council, despite all the corruption mentioned.

The out campaign arguments (apart from fisheries) all seem to unravel when you look closely. Brexit would be a massive risk.

kaributoo said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 2:30 PM

Think the honest answer is: We cant tell.
If we stay, will Euroland "modernize" - well not sure, why should it?

If we go, would Spain among others, react sensibly. No idea? No-one knows.

Modernize: get rid of corruption, become competitive (globally)
React sensibly: encourage Brits to stay (economic impact expats leaving is huge)

Wattsittome said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 2:43 PM

There are good and bad points for each side but they are confusing everybody. I am with briando55, we need to break it down this down to the nuts and bolts.
What will a brexit mean on a day to day level to those living (or planning to do so) outside the UK.

I am voting to remain as this is in the best interest for MY future irrespective of the top level political/economical white noise. So all those banging on about taking back control from the EU etc, I respect your views but they are not in my interest.

nicechap said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 3:44 PM

Nice piece Wattsittome I agree with you, more people need to think about how the outcome of this will affect them, we will vote to stay because its the best for us. I think going back would be a night mare, we could not live on the pension in the UK,if you think about cost of living, yearly suma, water bills, car tax and a lot of other things so much cheaper here and the best thing, The Quality of Life you cant beat that.

wodger said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 5:40 PM

I think there are a number of wammies if your income is UK generated,
The pound will fall further against the €, decreasing spending power.
UK pensions & investments will not keep pace.
It will be more expensive for UK citizens to buy your house in Spain if you wish to relocate.
In order to control entry into the UK visas may have to be introduced, This could mean visas for Brits entering the EU.
Limited low cost air fares back to the UK.
Will expensive private health insurance be required ?
Problems with Spain/Gibraltar?

tillymint666 said:
Saturday, June 4, 2016 @ 11:01 PM

The EU GOT IT WRONG right from the word go!!! Instead of carrying out an economic health check on countries wanting to join - they let in countries whose governments are corrupt, run by mafia styled criminals, whose citizens don't pay their taxes, don't have proper infrastructure, and are determined not to change ( Greece is just one such country, they retire at 50 - and when they die the family continue to claim their pensions!!). Why have certain countries been allowed to join ?- In the treaty it states that to join the EU countries need to demonstrate:

Price stability, to show inflation is controlled;
Soundness and sustainability of public finances, through limits on government borrowing and national debt to avoid excessive deficit;
Exchange-rate stability, through participation in the Exchange Rate Mechanism (ERM II) for at least two years without strong deviations from the ERM II central rate;
Long-term interest rates, to assess the durability of the convergence achieved by fulfilling the other criteria.

Well - I don't know about you - but not many of the countries who were allowed to join fulfill said criteria!!!
Instead - the EU laughingly concentrated on the shape of bananas and what's in a sausage!!!!????
They have ignored the real problems of the EU like uncontrolled boarders - allowing peoples from all over the world to head to the UK where they are free to tap in to free education, housing, healthcare etc!!! Here in Spain - only EU citizens or people paying in to the system can access services.
I agree with everything Malcolm Whitney said. Greece has again been given billions!!!! Why????? Where is the money coming from????? Certainly not the corrupt banks!!!!????? This whole referendum feels like a complete fiasco - played out to detract from the global problems that are threatening to overtake Europe!!!! If the peoples from all these war torn countries from africa and the middle east converge on Europe - then whether we are IN or OUT WILL NOT MATTER A JOT.
However - I voted to stay in - I love living in Almeria and would not want to return to live in the UK!!!

DJF said:
Sunday, June 5, 2016 @ 12:15 PM

Firstly, what has the comparison with the exchange rate of the dollar/Sterling being at a seven year low got to do with leaving the UK.
The comments about massive financial debts of many country in the EU and the richer countries having to bale out those which are known to be corrupt says to me that we should leave.
Trade will still continue and if tariffs are applied than we apply them back, companies will soon realise what side their bread is buttered and it is trade not governments that keep the economy going.
Vote out and let us get back our world markets such as Australia and New Zealand who suffered greatly when Europe said we couldn't trade with them after joining so as to protect their monopoly, in the long run this never works as have been evident in the past few years.

MANXMONKEY said:
Sunday, June 5, 2016 @ 12:36 PM

Sorry not to have come back sooner to BRIAN's comment about staying in and reforming the EU but I was laughing so hard I had to have a rest. Here's a short animation which is a little humorous but not as funny as yours Brian.
https://www.facebook.com/leaveeuofficial/videos/946139178817657/

hbennett said:
Sunday, June 5, 2016 @ 9:22 PM

I have read all the above comments & can only say that anyone who lives in Europe outside the UK or spends a lot of time in Europe must be mad to vote leave for the following reasons :-
1/ If we leave it is very likely that free medical cover will no longer be available to UK citizens living or visiting European coutries.
2/ Pensioners living in Europe outside the UK could finish up with pensions that are no longer index linked as are pensioners living in other Comonwealth countries.
3/ The Pound will drop against the Euro making the cost of living in other European countries more expensive.
That's apart from the other potential effects on the UK economy.
Vote STAY IN if you have any sense.