disenchanted's latest posts

06 Feb 2011 2:36 PM:

Hi Ceejay,

In response to your quote; "Yes I think it is a good idea for legal advice to be sought but who is going to pay for it? Those who currently pay nothing are certainly not going to". I have attached a copy of a posting made on 9 March 2010 at 14.22. I think it is page 17 on the links below. I am a non-payer and I contacted this guy because I wanted to pay for legal advice - as did several other non-payers. Where were you then??

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Hi folks,

As a newbie here I have just caught up with all the postings below and I have also read the somewhat enlightening postings on the eyeonspain forum at - Spanish Lawyers/Builders supply of water and electricity. Being a newcomer I cannot attach the link, but inspectahomespain quotes the following:.

This is a grey area as legally even in administration, which means they are still trading, the receiver has a legal responsibility to agree the payments of the builder which has been happening for example at some of the San Jose developments where I understand that the services are still connected and being paid for

It is quite complex as some utility suppliers will not connect up services without a COH so there are other examples where the builder stops paying for the utilities and the owners are left without power or water

Recently in Orihuela Costa when this happened the town hall stepped in an provided generators as they agreed the delay in the cOH were their fault

The fact still stands that if a company is still trading they, or their agents, are legally required to provide utilities if there is no COH

Now, picking up on a very valid point made by Throstle, can I ask if anyone is interested in setting up an action group to get some legal advice over this? Briefly I would see it working something like this...

1. We canvas as many residents/non-residents as possible to see if they are interested in making a donation to an El Pinet legal fund, maybe €100 per person.

2. Once we have some funds we find a very reputable solicitor from the local area who knows their way around the corridors of power within Elche council.

3. We ask them to contact San Jose to question the legality of not providing us with free services until COH is finalised. We ask them to liaise with Elche and San Jose' administrators to get a realistic timeframe for the completion of ALL units and services.

Hence, with just a few solicitors’ letters we could get advice on most of our issues without getting involved in expensive court actions. At the end of the process we could either return the balance of the money to donors, or donate it to a local charity. All invoices could be emailed to donors.

There would be NO remit to challenge the work of the CAM administrators and there would be NO remit to ask for guidance with internal arguments over community fees, etc. The process would only be in place to protect our interests against external agencies.

What do we stand to gain???

We would find out if San Jose’s actions are legal. We should get a detailed timeline for completion. We just might find that San Jose is indeed liable for all water and electricity costs up to COH.

What do we stand to lose???

Maybe €100, depending upon numbers.

If there is scope to proceed along this route then I would be willing to drive it forward.

Anyone interested?

Bob

Community thread: El Pinet

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17 Mar 2010 10:27 PM:

Dear neighbours,

I recently had the following chat with Maria De Castro;

Hi Maria, can you please offer some advice here;

Down at El Pinet we are still awaiting site completion and COH. You will be aware from threads below that the residents have decided to pay for their services (water and electricity) rather than challenge San Jose to pay them.

Last year a few residents called a meeting and formed an ad-hoc community. At this meeting they decided to pay €70 towards services and €20 towards Community fees each month. They also decided that non-residents (like myself) would pay €40 plus €20 per month regardless of how much time they spent in Spain. Unsurprisingly there were many defaulters and so the committee opted to spend all of the services fees and then all of the community fees on their water and electricity bills. This still left them in debt.

They have since discovered that their committee was illegal (too big) and dissolved it. The same few residents (18 owners out of several hundred) called an EGM to elect 3 smaller committees comprising of roughly the same people. They have now decided to change the community fee payments to €90 for residents and €60 for non-residents. It is their intention to spend the community fees to pay for all their services. They also appointed an Administrator who is threatening non-payers with legal action if they do not submit to their payment demands for the past year (when the committee was not even a legal entity).

I am really concerned at the way this is developing as I am unable to visit my property very often due to ill-health. I have not been to Spain for almost 3 years yet I am now being told to pay over €500 for water and electricity which I have not used. I understand my responsibility towards community fees and I have paid these in full, although I believe it is unfair that these have been spent on subsidising services for the residents.

Can this be fair?

Can you please advise me on where I will stand if I do not pay these fees. I am now receiving official demands from the Administrator and I am extremely concerned that I will end up in a court which I cannot attend.

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I cannot see the legal standing of that community to impose the payment of the fees to all owners as you said it was formed by 18 members out of hundreds. Was there a written agreement? Can I see it?

_______________________

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Hi Maria,

There was no written agreement and no agenda was sent out prior to the meeting. Minutes were sent out one month later along with the first demand for payment.

The minutes were very vague and just stated that the new community fees for non-residents will be €60. They are now telling us that they will use €40 of this money to pay for their own use of electricity and water whilst they are on builder’s supply. They have already used all of our community funds for this purpose.

Can we be forced to pay for their use of utilities whilst we do not live there? Is this all legal?

Thanks,

disenchanted

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No legal at all.

M

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I have now taken formal legal advice. I have been told to do nothing and not to sign for any recorded deliveries. I hate to think who could be paying for any leagl proceedings which might follow.

disenchanted

Community thread: El Pinet

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15 Feb 2010 10:32 AM:

Hi Maria,

There was no written agreement and no agenda was sent out prior to the meeting. Minutes were sent out one month later along with the first demand for payment.

The minutes were very vague and just stated that the new community fees for non-residents will be €60. They are now telling us that they will use €40 of this money to pay for their own use of electricity and water whilst they are on builder’s supply. They have already used all of our community funds for this purpose.

Can we be forced to pay for their use of utilities whilst we do not live there? Is this all legal?

Thanks,

disenchanted

Forum thread: mariadecastro

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13 Feb 2010 12:00 AM:

Hi Maria, can you please offer some advice here;

Down at El Pinet we are still awaiting site completion and COH. You will be aware from threads below that the residents have decided to pay for their services (water and electricity) rather than challenge San Jose to pay them.

Last year a few residents called a meeting and formed an ad-hoc community. At this meeting they decided to pay €70 towards services and €20 towards Community fees each month. They also decided that non-residents (like myself) would pay €40 plus €20 per month regardless of how much time they spent in Spain. Unsurprisingly there were many defaulters and so the committee opted to spend all of the services fees and then all of the community fees on their water and electricity bills. This still left them in debt.

They have since discovered that their committee was illegal (too big) and disolved it. The same few residents (18 owners out of several hundred) called an EGM to elect 3 smaller committees comprising of roughly the same people. They have now decided to change the community fee payments to €90 for residents and €60 for non-residents. It is their intention to spend the community fees to pay for all their services. They also appointed an Administrator who is threatening non-payers with legal action if they do not submit to their payment demands for the past year (when the committee was not even a legal entity).

I am really concerned at the way this is developing as I am unable to visit my property very often due to ill-health. I have not been to Spain for almost 3 years yet I am now being told to pay over €500 for water and electricity which I have not used. I understand my responsibility towards community fees and I have paid these in full, although I believe it is unfair that these have been spent on subsidising services for the residents.

Can this be fair?

Can you please advise me on where I will stand if I do not pay these fees. I am now receiving official demands from the Administrator and I am extremely concerned that I will end up in a court which I cannot attend.

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