rapp

Maria,

Please help

!0 of us bought new 3-4 bedroom houses at Pueblo Blanco Iznajar

When these were snagged by our Chartered Civil Enginneer it was stated the the hot water tank (50 lts.) was of an insuffiient size for our houses. The Developer stated that in practise if they proved insuffient he would change them for larger tanks. No more than 2 people can take a shower in the morning. He is now saying he supplied what the Architect specified and he will not change them.

What can we do, in the UK things sold have to be fit for purpose by law, is the the case in Spain?

Rapp

Hi rapp

I've just checked OUR contract & it states 75L so what does YOUR contract say ?

If it says 50L then you should have realised that was small.

DOES it stipulate 50L ??

(Edited to say we're not on your development & 50L is very small capacity for 3-4 bedroomed homes, ours is a 2 bed but what's on your contract as that's the key, surely ?)

PS It would have been a good idea for you to have put header as ' is 50L enough for a 3-4 bed property ?' rather than 'rapp' !! Others will think you're going to sing to us, I just happened to click on it as I was intrigued.

Hi Morerosado

I do not think the size was specified unfortunately.

Rapp

Where is your contract, Ray ? 

Hi,

I will check the paperwork tomorrow.. But all specifications were covered by a clause allowing the Developer to make changes.

What we need to know if changes are made, does what supplied have to be fit for purpose?

Regards,

Rapp

OK Ray, you need to wait for Maria de Castro or another lawyer posting on here to pop in, but, as I said before, the header doesn't encourage any of these professionals to look at your post, unfortunately. I'll ask Maria to come advise you.

In Spain it seems anything goes.

----------------------------------------

Edited to say I've just sent Maria a PM so she'll come soon, she always does. Check back soon.

Hello Ray:

Of course it is the case in Spain too that contract objects need to serve its purpose, things need to work, that is obvious.

In your case, as the contract object is a house, I would need to see the quality specifications that were given to you with the private purchase contract and how the tanks were described there.

Best regards,

Maria

Hi Maria, thank you for acknowleding my PM, as you always do.

Ray, as Maria says, you should've had (as I told you my husband & I had) a list of quality specifications attached to your contract which state what is included (such as ours has a 75L boiler).

But, I hear you say that 'but all specifications were covered by a clause allowing the Developer to make changes' so, Maria, that being the case, what now can Ray & other owners do please ?

That clause of freedom to change specifications is null and void.

I need to see the list of specifications but initially I would day that a lawyer´s letter to developers pressing him to direct a claim to the Consumers office may help.

Best,

Maria 

Dear Maria,

Thank you very much for your reply. 

I have now looked at the secification and this states:-  El Agua sanitaria se obtendra' mediante calentador-acumulador ele'ctrico de 50l, situado en la cocina o falso techo de cuarto de ban'o.

As this is in Spanish and the way it was written as 50l none of us would have realised the significance of this and the implication on a 4 bedrood property.

This size tank is totally unfit for the size of the houses and have been snagged as such.

In view of this are we wasting our time in trying to get this changed?

Regards, Ray

Dear Maria,

Thank you very much for your reply. 

I have now looked at the secification and this states:-  El Agua sanitaria se obtendra' mediante calentador-acumulador ele'ctrico de 50l, situado en la cocina o falso techo de cuarto de ban'o.

As this is in Spanish and the way it was written as 50l none of us would have realised the significance of this and the implication on a 4 bedrood property.

This size tank is totally unfit for the size of the houses and have been snagged as such.

In view of this are we wasting our time in trying to get this changed?

Regards, Ray

Hi Ray

Just goes to show you should get everything detailed in English (especially if you don't understand Spanish).

All our contract was also given us in English. Having said that the developer (in our English copy) very conveniently  omitted the paragragh that, in our Spanish copy, detailed WE agreed to pay all HIS taxes !! What we went through NOT to pay HIS Plus Valia, around two years later when this came to light, was unbelievable.

Our agent finally paid it as we'd (stupidly) used their so-called legal team & we insisted they should've checked the English written contract was indeed an accurate copy.

You need eyes in the back of your head, don't you ?

Dear Morerosado,

Our contract also said we must pay the builders taxes, but this clause was outlawed by a recent Spanish Law so we pointed this out and the charge was dropped. 

Unfortunatelythe promoter  is associated with the Developer, but staffed by British or English speaking personnel, wanted our snagging translated into Spanish but when we asked for responses in English they just ignore us.  In addtion if they do not wish to attend to items snagged they again do nothing

We even asked for the appliance operating instructions to be translated but again this request was ignored. I think Developers and Builders have had a sellers market for so long that some of them have still not realised that its now a buyers market and they need change their approach.

Rapp

This message was last edited by Ray Apperley on 4/29/2009.

its now a buyers market and they need change their approach.

Very true, Ray, I agree.

Good luck with this. I'll now bow out of your thread & let Maria continue.

 Well, I would just certainly try to send them a letter and request an appropriate one. Even when it is written in the contract, it does not fit the use it is aimed and  you can argue Contract and Consumers Law.

Are there other important snagging issues?

Maria

Dear Maria,

There are stiil a number of small items of snagging outstanding, which we hope they will get around to attending to.

However there also remains two other large items that are proving difficult.

We were told that our houses were pre-wired for satellite TV and the implication was that as most of the buyers were English speaking it would be Sky.

They have wired each individual house for satellite TV reception back to a junction box on each block.  However as far as we can see there is only one place to mount a 1.5 mter dish and  at this stage we cannot see a way of linking the cable from this dish to each of the individual blocks. A number of us were hoping to let our houses when we are not using them and the letting agents say English TV is a must.

We were also told that the community would have a swimming pool which was to be provided in phase 2. We now know that it is unlikely phase 2 will be built for a good number of years if at all.

I feel very guilty in mentioning these things to you as we already have had the benefit of your advice at no cost at present.

If we have to go to Court, you have my word that I will do all I can to see you get instructed.

Once again THANK YOU.

Rapp

Comments/answers below in bold green:

Dear Maria,

There are stiil a number of small items of snagging outstanding, which we hope they will get around to attending to.

However there also remains two other large items that are proving difficult.

We were told  told? is there anything about it in written? that our houses were pre-wired for satellite TV and the implication was that as most of the buyers were English speaking it would be Sky.

They have wired each individual house for satellite TV reception back to a junction box on each block.  However as far as we can see there is only one place to mount a 1.5 mter dish and  at this stage we cannot see a way of linking the cable from this dish to each of the individual blocks. A number of us were hoping to let our houses when we are not using them and the letting agents say English TV is a must.

We were also told in written? Any publicity?  that the community would have a swimming pool which was to be provided in phase 2. We now know that it is unlikely phase 2 will be built for a good number of years if at all.

I feel very guilty in mentioning these things to you as we already have had the benefit of your advice at no cost at present. No problem!

If there is publicity which mentions the pool, you have got rights to cancel the contract.

If we have to go to Court, you have my word that I will do all I can to see you get instructed.

Once again THANK YOU.

Rapp