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Mac's Poll - Let's Vote

Curious to know what the general opinion is? Cast your vote and let's see!!

POLL: Are you satisfied with the Spanish National Health Service?
Wednesday, September 25, 2013 @ 11:46 AM

I live in Valencia and to be honest I have never really had any major problems with the Spanish NHS apart from waiting times, which can be endless sometimes, however I imagine that is much the case in any country. However recently cost cuts are affecting services all over the country and most notably in Madrid where funding cuts have left local GP clinics in an unhygienic state according to medical workers.
Cleaners are no longer being paid to work enough hours to keep on top of dirt and rubbish, meaning the surgeries often go for more than eight hours without being tidied up or sterilised, say members of the Association of Doctors and Medical Graduates (AMYTS).
They have named and shamed three centres in the region – the El Naranjo clinic in Fuenlabrada, the Santa Mónica in Rivas Vaciamadrid and San Fermín in the city centre.
Remains of dried-up vomit, blood, used gauze, bandages and cotton wool, and overflowing bins have been seen throughout these three health centres.
And in the clinic in Abrantes – where over 70 per cent of cleaning hours have been cut - dead rats have been seen in the washbasins and inside the cracked plasterboard ceilings.

According to AMYTS, the regional health authorities in Madrid cut their cleaning bill by a third – to 35.4 million euros a year – by amalgamating the two works contracts held by different firms into one.
Then in February this year, one of the firms involved made several redundancies and enforced early retirements, and cut the remaining employees' hours by 30 per cent.

On the onther side of the coin the Government seems to be moving forward with a plan to make access to the public health service less of an ordeal by introducing a new healthcare card which will be recognised in all federal regions in Spain.

At present, all those entitled to State medical assistance hold a SIP card, but the individual format of each one is only valid in the patient's autonomous region – such as Andalucía, Murcia, the Comunidad Valenciana, and so on.

This can cause problems if a resident is on holiday or travelling on business to another part of Spain, since their medical data cannot be called up using their existing SIP card.

And those who are 'resident' in two different regions, because of owning properties they share their time between equally in each one, or working away during the week and being registered on the census in their place of business and main home, hold two SIP cards, which can cause admin headaches.

Health minister Ana Mato plans to create a different type of card which will be useable throughout the mainland and islands and in the two Spanish-owned enclaves on the northern Moroccan coast, Ceuta and Melilla.

This means doctors will be able to access medical data for all patients they attend to, even if they are temporary visitors from another region. 

For those that use or have used the Spanish healthcare, are you satisified with the service so far? 

Please cast your vote and leave a comment 

 



Like 4




41 Comments


J.P.R. said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 8:01 AM

My wife and I have used the Spanish health system both occasions being of an urgent nature requiring surgery and a hospital stay. We have nothing but praise for any aspect of it.


Life's veneer said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 8:13 AM

I think that there is a gulf between acute issues - dealt with from comments I have heard very well and chronic conditions where the primary care set up ie GP type medics is poor in my experience. We are in the process of paying for access to primary care services as a result.


Terry Hewitt said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 8:31 AM

I was in hospital in Murcia with cancer 13 times during 2010 and am grateful that they saved my life. The doctors were very professional. Sharing a room with Spanish people is not ideal when you are feeling very ill as they can have 12 noisy relatives standing round their bed and the television on for 16 hours a day. Generally I was well looked after, and fortunately had my partner to take care of many of my needs. It is more or less expected that a family member will be with you most of the time during your stay in hospital. As they usually have to sleep in an armchair it is not a lot of fun for them. Also it is important to speak some Spanish otherwise it can cause some problems. Unlike the U.K. where they would probably pay an interpreter it is your responsibility in Spain. As for patient care I would give them 9/10.


Tunnix said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 8:51 AM

I agree with Terry Hewitt - I too have been in hospital on two occasions for a few weeks. Also as out patient procedures I find
the care is excellent and am more than happy. I agree with the comment on the issue of too many noisy family members being allowed in the small rooms - they seem to think it is party time and again.when you are not feeling well especially after surgery. My problem and it is my problem is that I don'tv speak enough spanish - intensive course this winter!!


fyfin said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 9:48 AM

In our little town in Almeria we have just registered at the Health Centre and my wife has had an appointment with the doctor. She was seen on time, the place was clean and seems to be run very efficiently. The doctor spoke no English but why should he and when my wife used her Spanish he was obviously pleased that she had made an effort.
Nothing but praise compared to our experiences in a large town in UK but I guess like everything there's good and bad and we're lucky that we've found a lovely little town with a great mix of Spanish and some Brits and excellent services.


crm said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 11:19 AM

Best check if you are still entitled to healthcare- in Andalucia they did a sweep of foreigners on the system and removed them all (including EU citizens) in August of 2012. I am an EU national,living and working in Spain for 10 years and married to a Spaniard with a health card.Nonetheless I am now apparently entitled to nought.luckily I have Sanitas coverage.


HAWKINGS111 said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 12:03 PM

CRM.
We live in the Torrevieja area and those people that live here and work and pay taxes are allowed full national health facilities.
Thought this was national if you paid taxes.
TERRY.
Yes that is one of the many ways that the UK waste money by paying for an interpreter for people. I totally agree with Spain that it is non nationals responsibility to either speak their language or pay for their own interpreter.
We are very fortunate also that Torrevieja hospital gives each patient their own room with en-suite and it has a pull down single bed so that one of your family can stay with you in relative comfort.
We have both needed to visit the doctor at various times and i have been in hospital as an in-patient and overall am more than satisfied with the general care and attention given in spite of a very very limited knowledge of the language.


Content said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 12:56 PM

In the Marbella area the healthcare is fantastic, better than private care.


blue5147 said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 12:56 PM

Hello all, I have lived in Spain for 6.5yrs and spent 4 of those years in and out of Hosp and most of those in a wheelchair. I have nothing but praise for the Spanish NHS. My original problem was caused by an RTA in England and a Dr! who couldn't recognise a broken bone on an X-ray!! I have had approx. 5 operations just to replace a hip and am still waiting for a 'broken' ankle to be mended!! I wouldn't like to set foot in an English Hosp ever again, they are filthy and very poorly run, compared to Spanish ones.


Almeria resident said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 1:10 PM

We are (still) trying to get on the medical register - different story... I went to the local medical centre for emergency treatment after trying to buy anti-inflammatory products from the pharmacy. I was stung numerous times by wasps and after a couple of days my lower arm was the size of my thigh, with the skin so tight it looked as though I'd varnished it. The pharmacist told me I needed an injection and sent me to the medical centre. However the nurse there (the only person there) refused to even look at me as I didn't have a medical card or "numero de Seguridad Social" (Social Security number). I ended up back at the pharmacy to buy anti-histamine and Ibuprofen tablets leaving the nurse to her empty waiting room. I would have tried elsewhere but I couldn't even drive (we also live in the middle of nowhere!)


happy2beInSpain said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 1:24 PM

My husband has had two hernia ops and prostate cancer surgery.
All the medical staff involved in these three ops were professional,sympathetic and the surgeons spoke English and overall the health care in hospital was carried out tirelessly and cleaning and sterlising of wards and bathrooms was ongoing continuously. We hope that with the cutbacks on the monetary front things do not change too much for us all as healthcare in Spain outdoes that offered in the UK by miles


fyfin said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 1:28 PM

CRM and Almeria Resident - I don't know your circumstances but in CRM's case I cannot see why you would not be entitled, it's true that the rules changed by Royal Decree in Apr and Aug 2012 but I cannot see how it would affect someone who had been resident here for a long time. This link clearly shows entitlement https://www.gov.uk/healthcare-in-spain and a friend of ours living in Arboleas (Andalucía) has just obtained their Tarjeta Sanitaria with no problems because they had registered as a resident some years ago.
Also could apply to Almeria resident depending on when / if registered as a resident. The other option for you would be to have gone to "Urgencias" and show your EHIC card if you have one, this has worked for our friends who are not residents and just come and go between UK and Spain.


Romanski said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 1:49 PM

Just spent a week in Hospital as an emergency. I'll not name the hospital as certain parts were very good but others were ..lets say debatable and unfair that all will be tarred with the same brush.

If I lived 3 K (over the other side of the highway) I would have been at Torrevieja instead, of which I have heard nothing but praise. I totally agree with comments re relatives visiting.

I can understand the comments re language problems but with so many English speaking people living in our region (Alicante) and English being the largest spoken language I am surprised that very few of the staff speak the language. BTW I am lucky as my wifes natural language is Spanish, but would feel very sorry for those with no knowledge. Learning Spanish as a kiddo is quite easy, as a pensioner not quite so.

My GP and staff are excellent and deserve all the praise they get.

Just out of curiosity does anyone know of the of situation regarding the 10% pensioners have to pay for prescriptions is reciprocal in the UK to other EU members.


trigger said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 2:42 PM

i moved to spain in august this year i am 64 i went to my solicitor for advice about taxes and how to pay them i have had a place in spain for over 5 yrs and allways payed my non resident tax she told me as i had only just arived in spain i cold not pay for private insurance till i had been here for one year and as i am 65 next year not to bother as next year i will get it for free my other half is 56 at this time will she get it for free or will i have to pay for her


HAWKINGS111 said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 3:02 PM

TRIGGER.
Your wife will get it for free.
We came over 5 years ago when i was 66 and as a pensioner i got it for free. My wife then was 54 and she got it also for free immediately as well. Incidently, it also works the other way around if the wife is the pensioner and the husband is not.


fyfin said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 4:00 PM

Trigger, I don't know your circumstances but if you have been paying NI contributions recently in UK you could be entitled to Health cover in Spain via an S1 form obtained from Newcastle. This is what we did. Also I'm a bit surprised about the private cover as I would have thought the companies would be falling over themselves to take your money right away.
You'll also still pay non resident tax for year ended 31.12.2013 but in 2014 if you intend to stay in Spain permanently (more than 183 days in the year) you will be subject to Spanish taxes and I'm sure you know you have to register as a Spanish resident after 3 months.


tillymint666 said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 4:23 PM

We've been using the system for over 6 years - it can be a bit hit and miss - the doctor we have at the moment is wonderful - helpful and willing to try and get us the correct specialist. We are getting a new Health Centre soon - to accomodate the aging local population. However, the spanish system is getting more and more stretched - and I heard they were not paying the young doctors (not sure if that's true??) - and that specialists were moving abroad to where they were more appreciated. After an illness - I was sent to 3 different hospitals -I was sent to 5 different specialists and the care was very thorough (even though I was misdiagnosed in the first instance!!) Because our local hospital only treats certain things - we had 2 years of long journeys and the cost of interpreters (my spanish is reasonable - but most specialists prefer you to bring an interpreter - one is never provided - different from the u.k). All the travelling is quite onerous - but this is because we live inland. I also feel you need to be proactive when dealing with any medical establishment. You know your own body better than anyone else - so if you feel you need attention - it's up to you to make sure you get seen - even if it means finding the money to see a specialist privately. No different in that way from the U.K.
If you are unhappy with any treatment - there is supposed to be some form of accountability - but I can't imagine how you would access it. You also have to be quite robust - families are supposed to take care of your daily needs - the food is usually not to our tastes (you definitely DON'T get a menu like you do in the U.K.!!!!). Basically - we don't really know the system here - so we do tend to flounder a bit - and specialists and doctors are still looked upon as higher beings and not questioned like they are in the u.k. However, we accept that we're here - and we have to find our way round the system - to make it work for us - so far - we've managed to keep well after quite a few blips - and hope we can continue living here - and getting the best care we can.


Muffi's Mother said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 4:51 PM

I wish the clinics wouldn't change the doctors without warning you they were doing so. I wish it was possible to change doctor if there is a personality clash. I WOULD appreciate a hospital out of my area being able to access my medical notes when necessary. I wouldn't like to go back to the UK for medical care because of the dirt and because of my age.


Castalla said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 5:18 PM

We must admit that my wife who is Diabetic, has been looked after better than she was in the UK!!! they have taken great care of her & we are happy to say her diabetes is under control now so we have no cause to complain, also I was unfortunate to get Cancer in the UK & when we first arrived here I was sent to San Jaun hospital because I had a few problems, not life threatening glad to say, but they did all kinds of tests on me within 20 minutes of my arrival, which if that was in the UK I would have had to wait months for a appointment to have half of the tests carried out, so as I said we have no cause to complain, we are more than happy so far.


HAWKINGS111 said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 6:48 PM

FYFIN.
The S1 form from Newcastle only applies when you are a retired man, i.e 65 plus. Trigger is only 64.


fyfin said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 7:18 PM

No that's not correct, I got an S1 form for myself and for my wife and I was only 61 and my wife was 57 at the time. It explains it all on the link I provided earlier. Admittedly it's only for around 2 years so temporary but still worth having. As I said it depends on whether you were paying NI contributions recently.


mac75 said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 7:21 PM

Thank you all for commenting I am sure these comments will be extremely valuable to those considering moving to Spain as healthcare has always been one of the greatest worries for future expats. In my personal opinion, my family and I have generally been well attended, in hospital and in the local health centre, however we have had to fight for correct assistance from nurses on occasions when we have had a family member in hospital for a considerable length of time, especially at night. But then again there are some who work for vocation and others who do it just for money, this happens all over the world. In my honest opinion I feel healthcare and teaching are vocational jobs and too frequently here in Spain and I imagine in other areas too, you see people working in this sector who really shouldn't be.But that said on the whole I am very happy with the national health service.


Rob no longer in Madrid said:
Saturday, September 28, 2013 @ 9:26 PM

Is the healthcare system in the UK so bad that Spain actually looks good, wow that's pretty bad. I spent 7 years in Madrid and hated it, way too chaotic and disorganized for me. Trying to navigate a system when you don't speak the language what a nightmare, huge pain in the ass to find someone to translate for you for each and every appointment.

I've been back in Germany barely 6 months and am scheduled for a knee replacement operation and physico is done right at the hospital. What I like about the German system is that I can choose the doctor and clinic, not stuck with the local ensalud. I suppose if I was good at Spanish I wouldn't have been quite as bad, and yes I am reasonable at German, but still the healthcafe system in Spain is a nightmare.

As mentioned what I don't understand is how you navigate a system where you don't speak the language.

Rob


Peter P said:
Sunday, September 29, 2013 @ 2:07 AM

Local Medical centres we have visited in Almeria have been worse than useless. I say 'worse' than useless as they actually turn you away even if you are obviously in pain if you do not speak the language. Considering the number of non-Spaniards who visit this holiday part of Almeria they have to expect that not everyone is going to have a good command of the language. They even have signs up saying that if you do not speak Spanish or have an interpreter they will not treat you!
So, you are visiting on holiday and get ill but don't know anyone who speaks Spanish yet need urgent assistance - what are you supposed to do - surely the least they can do is examine you and try to get by? One experience was my wife getting serious cystitis - we visited 2 medical centres and even though my wife was in tears due to the pain all they did was tell us to go away - what sort of care is that?...it certainly doesn't happen in the UK. How can you turn someone away that is in obvious pain? Eventually we found a private clinic that would see her straight away. In just 10 minutes she was examined, had a urine test and given a prescription all very simple so why couldn't the medical centre do the same....they were not even willing to try - they do not even care about non Spanish speakers despite the amount of business and employment they bring to their area.
So unfortunately my view of this aspect of the Spanish Health system is absolute crap!


Rob in Madrid said:
Sunday, September 29, 2013 @ 7:15 AM

Maybe it's vain but I'm editing my comment from above.

Healthcare is quite good here as seen from some of the above comments but the main problem I see with Spanish healthcare as a foreigner is both language and culture.

My biggest fear in living in Spain was either an illness that required ongoing medical treatment or an accident requiring immediate attention, and the reason being language. While most doctors speak the English almost none of the support staff do.

For example

I was discussing treatment options with a doctor, when I left the receptionist starting jabbering at me in Spanish

Did you say

1. we'll send you info by post
2. please wait and I'll get you the info
3. bugger off idiot foreigner stop sucking our tax dollars dry :)

It was the second, but I couldn't imagine the fear I'd feel if I was dealing with something like cancer! The hassle of having to arrange a translator for each and every doctors appointment what a pain in the butt.

Secondly I just found the Spanish culture to be not to my taste, I like things organized and efficient. Yes some people love that (had a friend who 3 years after leaving still pines for Spain).




fyfin said:
Sunday, September 29, 2013 @ 9:51 AM

Fair comment Rob and people have had different experiences both in Spain and UK. Luckily my wife and I are in reasonable health so haven't had to test the system here in Spain but from what I have seen so far I am impressed. Language is a problem but it's our problem, we either need to learn Spanish to be fluent or take someone with us who is fluent.
When my wife did have problems in UK I was not particularly impressed as she nearly died because of misdiagnosis and had to have a more serious operation. The cleanliness of the hospital also left a lot to be desired.
Then when our friend took ill here on holiday we were impressed with the treatment and the cleanliness of the hospital in Granada but you have to accept that the aftercare is mainly up to you the relatives or friends and as he spoke no Spanish it was a bit traumatic for him.
However he feels as do we, that had the problem occurred in UK he might not have made it, but the Spanish doctor insisted on keeping him in and running more tests - he ended up having a double bypass.


Rob in Madrid said:
Sunday, September 29, 2013 @ 10:52 AM

Interesting thanks, sadly misdiagnosises happen everywhere, got a friend with a wierd chronic illness and an idiot doctor took him off his meds and nearly did him in.

As I commented to the wife many times if were more fluent in Spanish life would have been much much easier!

Sadly that is our own fault

Rob


rainbowdrop said:
Tuesday, October 1, 2013 @ 6:52 AM

As an American with a house in a small town in Spain, Aguilas. I have had an nie number for 9 years, an wondering when I retire in a couple of years will I be allowed a medical card. I speak Spanish pretty well and I'm always trying to learn more. I've looked into international insurance and can't afford the 1000 a month in my small pension, plus pay obamacare in the USA.. Anyone have any suggestions


tillymint666 said:
Tuesday, October 1, 2013 @ 8:08 AM

Hi Rainbowdrop
Unfortunately, the U.S.A. is not part of the E.U. - so you will not be entitled to the same 'care package' that E.U. people are. If you paid in to the system here - I think it's about 270 euros / month - you may be able to access care that way. I know younger friends who work here pay in to the system and can access care for all of their family. It's better than 1000 / month for private care. If you are thinking of returning to the U.S.A. - or if you are not a resident in Spain - then you will have to continue paying for private medical care - which is only fair - because I think people should only be able to access care if they have contributed to the system (except in an emergency of course).


rainbowdrop said:
Tuesday, October 1, 2013 @ 2:11 PM

I totally agree that it's only fair that I pay for insurance! I'm pretty sure my American insurance will partially cover me and if something catastrophic happened I'd do my best to go back to America to get care. I'm just wondering what the cost would be here to go for a routine checkup or a mammogram for instance.


christos1980 said:
Tuesday, October 1, 2013 @ 3:44 PM

For me the UK wins hands down. Too much chaos in Spain and for anyone over 65 and without relatives it can be a problem with a protracted illness. A friend of mine who lived alone returned to the UK because he was lonely while in hospital. I live in the south of England where I think the NHS offers a better service


tillymint666 said:
Tuesday, October 1, 2013 @ 5:26 PM

I've just been for my mammogram (don't know how much a private one would cost) - and the ladies doing it were made a point of telling waiting patients that they should now be speaking spanish (luckily - I've put in the time and can now converse adequately) - but they didn't really make the patients very at ease - friendly enough because I spoke spanish - but they don't know how to do TLC (U.K. medical staff are usually very friendly and helpful). However, we are getting the service - we just have to adapt to the style of medical care here - and learn the language!!


gus-lopez said:
Tuesday, October 1, 2013 @ 11:29 PM

Hi rainbow drop, do you have residencia to go with the nie number ? Do you live here at present ?


rainbowdrop said:
Tuesday, October 1, 2013 @ 11:53 PM

Not at the present time. I plan on getting it when I move there next year. And I do speak Spanish!


tillymint666 said:
Wednesday, October 2, 2013 @ 7:02 AM

Hi Raindrop - I'm sure you speak better spanish than me!!! I was referring to people in general - I know a lot of pensioners who live here and who have never had lessons and who speak poco espanol! They feel it's too difficult to learn a language at their age - and for many - who do not find studying easy - it probably is. It just makes life out here a lot easier if you try to speak the language. I have sympathy for those who find it difficult - we're not all natural students - and a lot of us live in areas where there are mostly english speakers - so we don't get a chance to practice what we learn. I just keep trying because I enjoy being able to converse with spanish people - and they are usually helpful and forgiving of mistakes.


J.P.R said:
Wednesday, October 2, 2013 @ 8:45 AM

Tillymint666
Last year a private Mammogram, in San Javier, cost 80€


rainbowdrop said:
Wednesday, October 2, 2013 @ 3:54 PM

Wow that's pretty cheap! I'm feeling better about moving! Between the horrid exchange rate from euros to dollars I will be stretching my pension. It was very hard for me to learn Spanish as well. I began when I turned 50 and took classes at a school. Very hard! But I live in California so make a point to speak Spanish everywhere I go. Most people who work in the supermarkets speak Spanish, as well as at the doctor's offices and at my g. I speak to the cleaning people at my job everyday as well. Can't wait to be fully bi-lingual! Hoping it will happen when I move! For those who don't speak it I say try! You'd probably be surprised how quickly you'll pick it up.


Charliemac said:
Monday, December 30, 2013 @ 1:00 AM

Why do a lot of ex-pats continually moan about the country that has taken them in. All I hear is " Oh! it's not like England Blah! Blah!. A lot of you complain about " Oh" the UK is not the same anymore" too many immigrants taking our jobs. What do you think a lot of you are doing in Spain? You are pushing house prices up, some are taking the part time jobs the locals used to do. When you go into bars, restaurants you speak your own language but complain about the Pa*k*'s and Indians back home who dare to speak their own language in their own towns. I have found there is a growing class thingy in Spain. The haves and have nots are still a big thing. The trend we have seen over the last 10 years of the working class family selling up and going to Spain with their neighbours to open a wee bar, have long gone.
The average Joe here now, know that the only thing Spain has to offer is a hot sun. It is expensive and tired compared to other offers from more interesting countries. Spain will still have a big tourist trade, but unfortunately, it won't be from the Brits.
Have a good new year. xx


J.P.R. said:
Monday, December 30, 2013 @ 9:09 AM

Charliemac - not sure what that has to do with a poll on the Spanish Health service as most of the comments above seem to be complimentary. And certainly the whingeing ex-pats you mention are notably absent in this area (Murcia)


fyfin said:
Monday, December 30, 2013 @ 9:19 AM

Charliemac , I think you have slightly highjacked a thread that was dedicated to the Healthcare here and not Spain in general. I don't think anyone in this thread mentioned immigrants or the UK not being the same etc. although there was plenty of discussion about the Spanish Healthcare system. I think our main problem was our lack of Spanish language which seemed to be a common thread and we can't blame Spain or the system for that.

As regards opening up a bar in Spain, this is something I could never understand, why people who had never run a bar in UK thought they could come here and be successful!!

Final point, yes it's the sun, the climate, the relaxation, that's why we're here! Best thing we ever did.


Terry Cooling said:
Wednesday, December 21, 2016 @ 5:16 PM

I had a triple bypass in Barcelona whilst living in Catalunya, the care and aftercare was second to none, three years ago we moved to Valencia and my wife was taken into hospital with a brain tumor, on arrival at the hospital in Valencia she was taken into a single bed room with two beds in, no more than 18 inches apart one being occupied and surrounded by relatives, in full view of them she was stripped naked and put into bed, when she complained about privacy and dignity she was laughed at and was told "This is how we do it in Spain"
After further complaints from a bed bath situation they eventually came up with a curtain barrier.
I have also spent time in our local hospital in Lliria, which is new and found them excellent in all areas.
It seems that there are no fixed standards in Spanish hospitals, you take your chance.


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