Lawyer taking money doing nothing

I was "represented", by aldea advisors, now gone bump, then, as recommended by an acquantance I went to costaluz lawyers, as I could prove due to ill health in the family I couldnt get a mortgage in england / spain, but after costa luz had my initial payment of 1500 euroes, and being passed from maria, then patricia, then "chriss", WHO i HAD NEVER HEARD OF, or dealt with, I simply asked "what have you done for the 1500 euroes thus far?, especially as I had to phone the firm first just to get a "telephone appointment", ( one of which just gave me the engaged tone) before we then were asked to pay a further 3,500 euroes that they wanted to represent us further, ?" I thought, what have you done so far? was a reasonable request?, patricia emailed to say "she could not inform me of this", !!!!, well we cant afford another 3,500 euroes just to phone for a telephone appointment with no advice regarding our chances of win or lose again, maybe costa luz will take offence at this post, but I can assure you this post is 100% honest and true, just wished all folk were, I wouldnt like to hear of honest hard working folk being seen off any more, I personally had to graft down a coalmine for my money, yours suicidal sam

Hi,

Welcome to EOS.

Unfortunately, I cannot read your post fully as it appears to run off the page. Also your punctuation is such that much of your post does not make sense.

I was going to PM you and advise you to edit and repost it. As you have not yet made sufficient posts to be able to use that facility I was unable to do this  (so saving you any potential embarrassment).

I suggest that you do repost your query/rant and maybe someone will be able to help you.

patronising or what?

I agree it is patronizing, in my view if you can't say something nice OR constructive without insulting new members then don't bother! Go and have a FAG!!!!

Yerweepal

I am very sorry to hear of your predicament.

In Spain at the moment and indeed for the last 12-18 months we have seen a lot of ambulance chasing as lawyer firms move from conveyancing into litigation, promising to recover deposits, call in bank/insurance guarantees, rescind contracts and I can tell you some of these firms are making a lot of money out of victims like you. Few would-be buyers have actually come out on top in terms of winning and recovering the money they were initially chasing etc.

You should have received a clear letter of engagement at the outset setting out how far your initial retainer would get you and in a good or bad scenario how much any course of action might cost and of course you should have been kept informed.

I hope as a result of this forum post you get an explanation of what has happened and why you are now being asked for more money if you were not advised this was likely at the outset.

I suggest you make a formal written complaint to the firm and if no satisfactory explanation is received then file a complaint with the appropriate colegio de abogados.

thank you for the last three posts folks, its greatly apreciated xx, to explain to sandra, my email was posted on a different forum initially, and because they didnt run secrtetarial courses down the coalmine where I worked,   I, unfortunately, am not too good on a pc, so I didnt know how to "paste and post to another forum", but as ive found a decent,  fellow working class chap from scotland, he kindly offered to  help in doing this for me, but, as he also was a manual worker, he doesnt deserve derisive remarks for his lack of computer knowledge, and I would like to thank my "wee pal" for this publicly, yours none too sincerely, stokey

 sandra, OUCH!!,    but many thanks for the last three posts folks, its greatly apreciated xx, to explain to sandra, my email was posted on a different forum initially, and because they didnt run secrtetarial courses down the coalmine where I worked,   I, unfortunately, am not too good on a pc, so I didnt know how to "paste and post to another forum", but as ive found a decent,  fellow working class chap, from scotland, he kindly offered to  help in doing this for me, but, as he also was a manual worker, he doesnt deserve derisive remarks for his lack of computer knowledge either, and I would like to thank my "wee pal" for this publicly, xx ,   "pick your wreckage up",  sandra, because I believe you have just been "shot down" , going by the three decent people who have recently posted  since your comments,

Thanks Justin, for sorting out the post. 

OOooops!!

I genuinely thought the poster had, frustratedly, posted in a hurry or in a temper and was the reason for the hap-hazard punctuation etc.,.

hey sandra, no worries mate, im frightened of women, so we dont mind if an apology isnt forthcoming?  , so  no grudges, emails can always be misunderstood thats why I like the old fashioned way of talking face to face, or on the phone, yours sam x

I am with CostaLuz Lawyers which I decided to use as Justin (Owner of this site) and the Forums are very positive about their service and the results they have obtained.

They got the developer off my back and we are currently progressing through court, but the road is long as I am 18 months in, with about 12 months to go on present estimates.

clive ive emailed maria at costaluz I will report on this forum when she has accepted my telephone appointment request to discuss mine and many others concerns, just wondering on this webpage how do you edit or delete previous posts if you are not the last one on it , as ive soon noticed im not alone in making" the odd phoo par",

This message was last edited by stokey on 25/01/2010.

They do provide me with monthly updates, but the courts are full of people looking for refunds so there is a backlog of cases. Most of the time I get a response in a day or two from emails which is their preferred option and they do put everything in writing.

I spoke with 3 different lawyers before opting to go with Maria and CostaLuz and they were all charging about the same amount in fees, so it is the going rate unfortunately.

One thing for sure I will never be listening to the many experts again, I should have paid off the mortgage instead.

Anyone seen the delete button for when you post twice by mistake!

clive, I cant see the edit button if you want to ammend or remove a previous post either

Clive and Sam,

You cannot edit a post AFTER someone has replied to it.

This prevents people making inflammatory posts and then, once a number of people have replied, deleting it and rendering the whole thread unintelligible. Therefore it is best to carefully check over any replies you make and edit them BEFORE you press the 'Post reply' button.

If you press the 'reply' button twice or more by mistake and send multiple replies, and you immediately realise it, then you can edit the last duplication only.

You cannot delete the whole reply 'box', only it's content.

Like Clive, I too am with Costaluz. I was sent a copy of their 'Terms and Conditions' BEFORE  I paid them any money. Then I sent about 1.5K euros for them to start putting the case together and the next amounts were to pay for the Preliminary Hearing (PH)  and the court fees. 

They have a (newish) system whereby they contact you by email every three months with a statement of the progression of your case. You need to download it to your computer in order to read it as it comes in 'pdf' format and appears as an attachment in their  email to you.

I initially contacted them in June 2008 and my PH was in October 2009. As Clive states, there is a backlog of cases clogging up the Spanish courts and, depending on the  nature of your action, it can take years.   

Good luck to you both. 

We are welcome to admitt criticism on our services and available to all explanations. I need to add that every explanation needs someone who is willing to understand at the other side.

First thing we do when we are dealing with a new client is to send a General Information document and a budget of legal costs where everything related to both the work procedure and the costs is explained from the very beginning, as much as we can.

When people ask for copies of our writings, we  need to deny the petition as it is part of the know-how of the  company and the litigation company. Of course the content of the writings is always explained and a copy of the head, signature and acknowledgment of reception by counterparty is also available too for those who ask.

Litigation department´s and Court´s  workload are realities which influence the timing of the case, but of course, clients rights are always covered in the meantime. And we are presistently trying to improve the services and the timing involved, to the extent that is within our hands´reach.

Anyhow, please send your claims and complaints to us as we will bery happy to look at them and process them as much as we can. Sometimes, clients wishes and petitions cannot be satisfied, that is part of the limits of every human activity, but we always take them into account and try to bring solutions near to their petitions.

Sam... please let me know who you are when we talk on the phone as I cannot recognise you right now.

maria I have sent you private emails to request a telephone appointment, with no reply, so could I please talk to you to remind you of who I am ,rather than me speaking to patricia, chriss or whoever further down the line please, as you are a spanish person who I hope still believes in family values, please read my private emails for a moment before you tell me when is convenient for you, that I can be allowed to call you,and I did ask what your company did for the 1500euroes when united golf didnt even know you were representing me, so maybe your company hadnt even contacted them, perhaps you would not know you had not ?  , I hope you can now find my file ,ps sandra for families like ours, and im sure others are in also a desperate situation your little" funny picture" and sarcasm over folks intelligence are not welcome, im sorry folks for this rant/ post, but  this is serious business? , sorry for any spelling errors,ive picked a bad day to stop smoking I guess? yours m s hewitt (sam)

This message was last edited by stokey on 26/01/2010.

This message was last edited by stokey on 26/01/2010.

This message was last edited by stokey on 26/01/2010.

This message was last edited by stokey on 26/01/2010.

This message was last edited by stokey on 26/01/2010.

This message was last edited by stokey on 26/01/2010.

well said

 Thanks Mr. Hewitt. Now with your last name I can recognise you. I was actually talking about your file with Patricia yesterday and she is not aware of you being unsatisfied. There must be an error. 

Also I am not aware of any PM of you requesting a phone appointment.  Are you receiving last emails from Patricia?

I have just confimed with Patricia you are being assisted. She is sending to you an email today. I do hope and wish you can say better things about us now :)

Cheers!

Best wishes,

Maria

Congratulations Sam on deciding to 'Stop Smoking'. It's been about seven years since I stopped and I know how difficult it can be and how irritable you can become.

 I found that replacing stimulant type drinks such as tea, coffee and alcohol with water helped. Also whenever the craving for a cigarette came over me I would   drink lots of water or clean out a cupboard or drawer. Do something, just to distractt me until the feeling passed.

Now, like many ex-smokers, I cannot stand the smell of cigarette smoke .

 Stick with it, the financial benefits are huge these days with the price of cigarettes but more important are the benefits to your health.

edited to enlarge the font
 

maria, after recieving patricias emails today, I will continue to give further updates whether good or bad on the service you provide, is that not fair?, lets see what time will tell, I also sincerely wish I will be able to say better things about your firm,  as I have not had contact with you since my initial conversation, I can apreciate thats how firms work, but maybe explains how you were unaware of lack of communications, yours sincerely  mark samuel hewitt  (sam)

Dear Sam:

With all my respect and willing to reach an understanding between we both.

Through a very qualified member on my team and lawyer ( Patricia) we have been providing a quality service to you for months now. The fact developers do not want to settle out of courts ( which is commun these times in Spain), specially due to the important lack of financial sources they have, does not mean we have not performed our work with full committment and risponsability from day 1.

I undertand the results right now are not what you were expecting, but we always make clear to all our clients, that we cannot assure a success and less even in the out of court stage.

We have proposed a new action to you today which I think it is very effective for different reasons: enough precedent Case Law, Law and own results, but even though I cannot assure you a 100% success on this.

I do humbly think we have been and are doing all in our hands and no less that it has been promised to you and I am very hopeful on a good outcome. But again: patience is needed.

Please email me directly if you need further explanations.

Best,

Maria

Ps.- For the rest of the members, my apologies as I do understand this type of discussones is not what you are looking for in the forum. Most sincere apologies

,maria, I agree this should not be discussed on this forum, please feel free to telephone me tomorrow at your convenience to discuss, as ive requested a telephone appointment with you two days ago, yours sam

Ok. Please send an email with your phone number.

For those of you interested.... we also have happy clients :) Forgot to mention that in my last post. If you want to read them, please click here

I believe many Spanish law firms are guilty of taking on too much lucrative litigation work and do not really have the resources to run all these files. I would also go so

A few years ago we saw the same problem with conveyancing expanding rapidly on the back of the property boom with quality and client service going out the window as inexperienced newly qualified lawyers or trainee (pasante) lawyers were given too much responsibility.

A client of a Marbella based law firm said before the property boom he could always meet and speak with his laywer in his dingy upstairs office but then he got busy and he moved to a plush new office and hired lots of new staff with names changing by the week and this good lawyer no longer had time to meet and speak with his old clients and he had no interest in them whatsoever as plane loads of buyers arrived over to buy all those beautiful off-plan properties ........the money just rolled in!

In some respects this new wave of litigation is the direct consequence of these failing lawyers and the poor contracts they drafted or negotiated and for which they took fat fees at the time!!

Mr Hewitt has every right to ask what was done for his EUR1,500 and in my opinion if all you managed to do was send a Burofax to which more than likely the developer did not respond then you have overcharged if no direct negotiations took place with the developer to achieve any out of court settlement?

Also I believe Mr Hewitt is entitled to receive a copy of the Burofax and also to ask for a time/activity ledger with narrative etc. Does the baremo (scale fees) not apply? Any decent lawyer would have no hesitation in providing this information to a client if the work was indeed done. Also I think if a new lawyer was appointed then under the venia you would have to produce/release certain information?

To me this is an interesting topic as I am always looking to see if expats are being treated fairly and getting value for money particularly from their appointed Spanish laywer. Lawyers are always willing to meet potential clients so why ignore them or fob them off on junior staff once they have been reeled in?

This is a message really for FARO.  I recognise your name from another forum.  Would you be good enough to disclose who you are!!!!  Not that I don't trust the comments on this site but you write like a Lawyer!!!!!

Faro, some good tips and advice and fees etc, just what this forum needs and if you are a lawyer I think you will be a good one, not many of them around I'm afraid,  thanks

Faro,

Thank you for your summary of the situation that led up to the mess  that greedy Spanish lawyers created during the Property Boom. Yours is the kind of post that has been sadly lacking on   discussions about  the  quality of service to expect from   your Spanish lawyer.

The average person deals with a lawyer  perhaps three or four times in their life-time. I.E., buying a house, making a will or sorting out the estate of a relative. Litigation for most people is a rarity let alone litigation in a foreign country and language.

After being well and truly shafted by one Spanish lawyer it is no wonder the amount of trust people have in a second one (albeit a recommended one) can only be described as fair. How could you have complete trust? You would be a fool indeed to do so.

 With regard to knowing you have  rights   to view documentation  and to see  receipts as proof for work done during the progression of the case, well that would be news to most people . That's IF they knew what to actually ask for, since the internal mashings of the legal process are a mystery to most. A situation you might say some Spanish solicitors have taken full advantage of.

Could you please explain:-

'a time/activity ledger with narrative etc.' 

and

'the baremo (scale fees) '

Also you state,

'if all you managed to do was send a Burofax to which more than likely the developer did not respond then you have overcharged if no direct negotiations took place with the developer to achieve any out of court settlement'

 Should the lawyer send their client a detailed statement of  the initial action they take i.e., they sent a burofax or had face to face negociations with the developer or whoever?

  Should it include a summary of  the points discussed, offers made (if any)  and  the outcome i.e., no reply, or reached an impasse, and include copies of all documentation ( names and addresses of people contacted, dates and receipts) that supports those actions and details the costs incurred?

 Should this  be sent as a matter of course or only when requested by the client? Is it the clients right to have all this documentation or just  'good practice' for the lawyer to supply it?  Surely a client would be better informed on how to proceed, i.e., spend more money, with this knowledge under his belt?

Finally, when it is determined the case must go to court and a Preliminary Hearing is scheduled, what actually happens? Also at this stage should a good lawyer send their client a detailed statement of the proceedings?

Sorry to be so long winded but now I have a 'Neutral' information source I'm not letting you go. 

P.S. I should also thank Sam for opening up the discussion that led you here.
 

This message was last edited by sandra on 27/01/2010.