No Brits please!

Re DonLochnagar's last posting,  I don't think his belief that '90% of the population would like to swap', is strictly true. The UK may not be the best place in the world (and I've lived in many different parts of it during 40 years as an expat) but there are things to recommend it. Fantastic theatre, galleries, museums, history, etc., not everything in the UK is bad. As for people moaning, in my experience most people moan about things in their own country. I'm sure the  Spanish moan about the immigrants in their country too. Don't forget that although the British refer to themselves as 'expats' most of them are immigrants in all but name.  I should also clarify my last post. I meant 'time to leave the forum'.  I felt the mood of postings was changing.  Glad to have been part of the discussion!

Luckycat,

as you indicate the UK has advantages. All locations have plus and minus points. I spent a long time living and working in the City of London and miss many of the 'facilities'. Also most things in the UK work be it infrastructure or organisational systems.  In Spain I lived in Barcalona, mainly to have access too many of the Art and Cultural aspectsas well as the sailing,  not present in the smaller towns along the Costas. But each to there own.

Moaning is a UK passtime. Always tell a migrant recent or long term from the UK they will be moaning. Last year I was returning to Dubai where I spent the past few winters and was waiting in line for a taxis. In front of me was a couple from the UK who starting moaning about the long wait for taxis and was disrespectful about the Country. Police turned up took them away and we read in the papers later they had been returned to LHR.

Since being back in Oz (returned Feb 2012) have come across many migrants some new some long term who moan. I thinks its just the way of the British I think its there way to strat a conversation. Brits in paradise and they still complain - too hot, beers TOO cold, the beach is full of sand .. it goes on and on and on.

Enjoy your Sunday.

David

David,

It's not good to over pigeon hole people.  I've noticed that you seem to have a bee in your bonnet about "moaning Brits"...does that make you an Aussie with a chip on your shoulder ?  Surely not ! 

I've also lived Dubai.  In my time there would be no way that a couple of Brits would be deported for the behiour you outlined.  Brits were respected more than any other nationals, to the point that it was almost embarrassing.  Times may have changed but I suspect this was an isolated incident that you are using, possibly embellishing, or perhaps there was more to this story you have used to make your point.

But in the UK we have amazing freedoms, compared to other nations.  I really like and admire the USA but you still have to bite your tongue when there - they may see themselves as "leaders of the free world", but their freedom has considerably more provisos than ours - forget it at your peril.

So we speak our minds, often making comments spontaneously because we know that in our home country we can largely do so without facing any retribution.  Yes there are a few that over indulge, but don't knock it, this is the closest to a real democracy as you're ever likely to see.

Jacarander...

I know exactly what you're talking about and I get the point that you're making.  You're right, of course, the type of ex-pat that wants to sit around drinking and gossiping is usually of 'a certain age' because it's only (usually) people of a 'certain age' that can afford to do this.  Other, younger ex-pats are (usually) too busy looking after kids/working for a living.  I realise you are not generalising.  There are thousands of us certain agers who aren't remotely interested in sitting around drinking and gossiping as a way of passing their time.  And I understand the damage that some of these folks can do.  Dear friends of ours lost everything they had worked for and built up in Spain because a group of jealous expats saw a chance to bring them down by denouncing them for things they had never done, and involving like-minded local corrupt officials to 'remove' our friends of everything they had.  Hard to believe but absolutely true.  Our best friends (another couple) are now back in the UK because they couldn't take living amongst the large group of expat gossips who sat around in bars making life miserable for other expats who wouldn't join in with them.

However, you are talking about certain types of people as a whole...whether expats in Spain or not.  My youngest son has recently been a vicitm of just the type of gossips you mention, only these particular gossips are a group of young women here in the UK, urged on by my son's ex girlfriend who didn't like the fact that my son ended their relationship.  She even went to the extent of posting untrue statements about my son on Facebook.  After months of this, the gossip has finally died down as friends of my son who know the situation have rallied round to support him and let others know the truth of the situation.

So, choose to live in Spain for whatever reasons you hold dear and yes, be careful of where you choose to live, in the same way as you should choose carefully wherever you want to live in the world. We love living here in Lincolnshire and we love living in Spain whenever we're there.  How lucky are we to have the time and finances to be able to do both? Yes, very lucky.

Luckycat

 I take your point but the main reason people wouldn't want to live in the sun, (I'm Scottish BTW so I've seen less of it), is generally because they have either poor health, not enough money or probably mostly family.  It's only the frist two that apply to me, so I'm alright then!

Maddiemack, yes I totally agree with you about types of people, I think that the danger is that when there are large groups of brits living together...and I only have experience  with brits.....it is easy for some people to get sucked into the negativity, they are afraid that if they dont join in with the majority then they will be the next target and become isolated. I can totally understand how the incidents that you refer to have happened, there are many similar incidents that I know of, locally a recently widowed woman is having her life made miserable by rumours at a time when she needs support...there are some extremely vindictive people around and many people have difficulty in challenging them...and why should they, they didnt come here to live with so much conflict. I also acknowledge that this happens in the UK as well, the difference being that there is so much more choice there to make friends from all walks of life. After 7 years in Spain I do still struggle with the language as I am not far off being of a `certain age` so my memory is not what it was, but I can get by with additional help from drawings/sign language etc all done with as much humour as possible. As for those people on here who seem to think that I am advocating that they should lose their uk culture and identity by immersing themselves in spanish culture...the two things are not mutually exclusive ( i even have a chunk of Iceland cheddar cheese in my fridge...shock horror)  What I will never be able to accept is the negativity that impacts so badly on many people living here.  We live in a beautiful country with so much culture to see and be involved in...if the price of fuel is getting a bit much share outings and expenses with others, save cash by taking a picnic out with you but above all get out there explore and enjoy, laugh and have fun despite some of the the bureaucratic frustrations that exist.

What really annoys me about  some ex pats is their insistance on living as they do in the uk, not having done any research about Spain, things like refusing to pay income tax on their uk  pensions (excepting crown) bank interest, etc in Spain, continnuing to drive their uk plated cars.Spai is missing out on millions of euros from these people, at a time when they can least afford it. plus, there is the abuse of the Spanish NHS with misuse of the EHIC card, but don't get me started!

here here Luckycat.  The UK has loads to offer, well here in the south it does.  I don't know about the north though.  I love the theatre and walking around sometimes in central London by the Thames.  Our art galleries are fabulous as is the V&A - I love it all.  The architecture is awesome in London as well.  I used to spend a lot of time in BCN and that is my second favourite city.  As a non drinker when I am in Spain I do tire of the brits and the bar culture, but that's just personal discrimination.  Brits do love to moan yes, it's part of our psyche and it can also be very funny and when abroad this can be part of the simpatico bonding of the ex pat.  Spain is a gr8 copuntry but while we are extolling the virtues of Spain we must remember the virtues of the UK as well, of which there are many.

 To all you disgruntled people, give us wave as you leave please

BYE

Well said, desamperados.  Cheerio, cheerio, cheerio!

 It never ceases to amaze me the amount of Brits living here who have made no effort at all to learn Spanish. The other day we were in Duquesa ( Costa Del Sol) and my Spanish girlfriend went into a local business to ask where the nearest bus stop back to Estepona was the British guy as it turned out inside couldn't understand a word she said even to the point that he couldn't even say in Spanish sorry i don't understand you, his only retort was in English i no speak Spanish!!!!

In England it seems we are quick to criticise immigrants who cannot speak English. It smacks of double standards to me!!!!

If you want to live in Spain at least try to learn the language even if you only manage a few words, In my experience it is always greatly appreciated by the locals.

Es verdad, Saggyraver.  Los Britanicos son muy mal en appriendo una lengua diferente. Mis vecinos no pueden preguntar un cafe en un restaurante!

Don

"Es verdad, Saggyraver.  Los Britanicos son muy mal en appriendo una lengua diferente. Mis vecinos no pueden preguntar un cafe en un restaurante! "

Well OK,  I guess the Spanish would sort of understand what you are trying to say.

Well I thought  it was a fair effort after being in the pub watching the footie for 5 hours!!  :)