How many off plan properties have been sold?

Those of us who put down deposits for off plan properties which were never completed have been dismissed as 'A few protesters'. The absence of the legally required bank guarantees or even the guarantees given have been proved, like the law designed to protect us, to be worthless. In the light of the millions of Spanish properties sold sucessfully to foreign buyers we are a 'few protesters'. Everyone understands that you can't please all of the people all of the time and therefore this 'defence' appears to be quite acceptable.

I have listened to legal experts, read forums and blogs, signed petitions, contacted MPs and MEPs written letters etc, etc. Our numbers, compared to the millions of satisfied home buyers in Spain is not going to impress anyone. I am looking for a new approach but I need some help from others in the same position.

Bearing in mind the 'few protesters' tag proves that the numbers of people can be dismissed as insignificant. What will make people sit up is how much money has been swindled. The total amount of money we have lost will make far more interesting 'copy' than a percentage figure of Spanish home buyers.

I was unlucky enough to be caught up with a development called 'Trampolin Hills' in Murcia. I am told that 2,000 of the 3,000 properties on offer were sold off plan. These properties were mainly villas of the same design and were sold at about the same price. A deposit of around 30,000€ was required to reserve them. The sum is not difficult to work out. 2,000 units @ 30,000€ each = 60,000,000€. SIXTY MILLION EURO'S, now that's a sizeable amount but this is just one development.

Just imagine if we were able to multiply the figures for all the developments across Spain. However this is probably not possible but even if we could hazard an informed guess at those we know of I beleive the figures would be such that 'the few protesters' defence would fall apart. The figures could be in the region of thousands of millions of Euro's. Billions in fact. 

The media would have a ball with a story of that magnitude. But we need as much research and proof as we can get.so I need your help in getting it all together. All I need are some figures for other developments. Eye on Spain informs us that they have 4,500 development threads on this site and I am aware of Keith Rule and the 'Finca Parcs' petition but I don't have any numbers of how many were sold off plan. 

If you think this approach has some merit please send me a private message with any figures you have regarding your own development. After all we all want our money back and the conventional routes don't seem to be working for us, so thinking outside the box could be our only way forward.

Thanks for taking the time to read this and with your help maybe we can rock the boat in our favour. 

Regards and good luck to you all,

Rambi..

Nice idea in principal but i would imagine it would be very difficult to get an even informed guess.

I also bought on TH and put down deposits of 65,000 euros per property so the 60m Euros that you estimate for that site alone could be as much as 90 - 120 m Euros.

I know it doesn't address your problem direct but Spain's international reputation has been so damaged that it will take years, or cost billions, to restore confidence in their holiday home / investent property market. What a missed opportunity for great wealth. Yet another own goal.

I take my hat off to anyone who can sell a Spanish home to a cynical British buyer. It must be as difficult as selling combs to baldy men. Such a pity because as you say, for those who weren't conned it was a good long term investment; so many have now been scared away. There are no winners in this; Spain suffers as well but it was inflicted.  

It's Spain's self infliction, called "corruption".

Great idea Rambi, and to be honest Ruth has already suggested this level of "theft" but I'm all for gaining the evidence.

Could our own Justin not assist by a global request on every community thread? It would be of great use in the long term, as this downward spiral is doing no-one any favours, and the movement for reform needs support from all quarters..

Thanks for the response.

I did think of that ads and I wondered if it were possible to post my message on all 4,500 community threads but there seemed to be no mechanism to do this. I would welcome your suggestions and support as to how I could get this done.

Mike, if you think the Spanish have shot themselves in the foot then I think you are mistaken. It is obvious by the recently introduced Property Road Show and the fact that they appear to believe in their own hype and legal system.

We have got to realise they think of us as "a few protesters" who somehow are unable to get it right . We are made out to be the 'stupid foreigners' who got it wrong. We did it to Manuel in Fawlty Towers and they are doing it to us.  Yes WE are cynical but there are millions out there who will be convinced because they want to believe the dream. After all they are STILL selling Time- share. Also they don't know anything about this, they are innocents to the slaughter. I took our story to the local Tenerife Property Newspaper. They had never heard of law 57/68 and did not believe me. They checked with some of the leading estate agents who also had never heard of it. So my 'story' was dismissed because they did not, or could not believe me and also because it might have 'rocked the boat' for some of their advertisers.

Good to hear from you pff001. This is the sort of information we need. My own deposits were in the 30,000€ region, but it just goes to show that even with conservative estimates the figures stack up nicely.

A good detective has two rules. Think like your adversary and follow the money. We have been too easy to dismiss. Our worst enemy is apathy. In my opinion we should play to our strengths and show up thier Achillies heel, GREED. We can only do this by getting the facts of this giant financial fraud. What is there to lose except our own money?

Rambi.

Well, homes do continue to be sold in Spain to overseas buyers.  And yes, there are millions of satisfied home owners. 

Besides you can"t sell if there is no one there to buy, and it beats me why anyone would want to buy time-share in the first instance. 

Patricia

I agree with your thoughts Rambi.

When I first launched the Bank Guarantees In Spain Petition in August last year I did approach Justin to request that he mentioned the Petition in the Eye on Spain newsletter and also if he could kindly inform everyone on the existence of the Petition by making a posting on every community thread.

Justin kindly included details of the Petition in one of the EOS newsletters last year and also said that he would make a posting on every community thread.  Unfortunately to date for whatever reason he has not been able to do this.  I will contact him again regarding this matter.

Around the time of the Spanish Property Road Show in London on 4 May and in response to the negative press coverage of that event the Spanish Government defended their position by saying that only 1% of all 'foreigners' living in Spain are affected by any type of property problem.  In my opinion even that 1% is a vast under estimate.

However..............

The big problem and a fact that I have pointed out to them is that they say only 1% of foreigners 'LIVING IN SPAIN' have a problem.  People who are victims of Bank Guarantees abuse are clearly additional to this 1%, because people like me and thousands of others who never received a Bank Guarantee for their off-plan deposits and never received the property are not 'LIVING IN SPAIN' - because we never got the property.......

Also those that did receive a Bank Guarantee and now find the Bank are refusing to honour it are also not classed as 'LIVING IN SPAIN' - because they did not get the property either..............

So those affected by Bank Guarantee abuse are all in a 'black hole' and are ADDITIONAL to that rather conservative Spanish Government estimate of 1%.

So in all their figures they have not even taken account of those affected by Bank Guarantee abuse.

The Spanish Government are in denial regarding the scale of the problems.

Kind regards

Keith

PLEASE JUSTIN CAN YOU HELP US WITH THIS?