El Pinet

If you have a part finished property and NO KEYS why are you paying anything at all to anybody?. The community fees cover the expenses of the community. You are not yet a part of it.  I can only think of:  pool linked to your deeds, communal lighting...in the flats,  the garages in the flats.    Anything else? 

Very few will have had 5 years of freebies from San jose......some of it will have been in the price. They new the rules, they flaunted them.

Elche has the bond and charges owners tax, they should be invoved more. I suspect the money is spent else where.

Question>>>>  have San jose employees infultrated the ' committees'?

Will get there soon and report on the progress, but I gather it is slow, very very slow.

'

I think you should all be keeping your eye on the bigger picture regards SJ and it's subsidiary companies  just   as a guide to what you can expect in the future  from SJ . On the EOS  forum look at the   Santa Ana Del Monte community forum and  and Playa golf forums .Knowledge is power SJ are crooks !!!!!!!!

Hi, sorry should have mentioned we have another property on EP and this one is habitable.

Re SJ, I think it is agreed they are unscrupulous in the way they have dealt with the development but hopefully now CAM have got involved as Administrators they have less control. 

Hi, sorry should have mentioned we have another property on EP and this one is habitable.

Re SJ, I think it is agreed they are unscrupulous in the way they have dealt with the development but hopefully now CAM have got involved as Administrators they have less control. 

I have received another demand for 60 euros this morning

I agree that we should pay our community fee of 20 euros

However I understand that the money I have paid into the community fund has paid for other peoples usage of these services

I also wonder as I have paid for this could I use a private pool in someones garden as my money has paid for the water in it and the electric to run it

Can someone please tell me why I should pay an extra 40 euros per month for electricity and water when I do not use it.

I do not mind paying for it when I use it

Maybe if a resident or a member of the committee is reading this they could answer my simple question 

 Hi Elpaso800,

This is my first ever post on this forum even though I have been following it with interest.  I am  a non resident and have been paying my fees in full.  I also received another letter this morning requesting the €60.  At this point I too would like to know where the money goes exactly.  As in a previous post someone wanted to see a financial statement and I think this is a very good idea as they have our email addresses they could perhaps send us one monthly and the people paying both resident and non resident could see where their money goes and then they might not feel so bad. (or worse).  I was over there  earlier this year for the first time in two years and although my property is finished I booked into a Hotel simply because I was unsure of the water and electricity supply.  Perhaps with the financial statement ( broken down)  they could also send an update for the water and electricity monthly or does the fact that we are paying our fees guarantee us water and electricity.  I do think the bill is a bit expensive but if it gets El Pinet finished it will be worth it.  

If there are say 150 properties in one of the yet to be established communitties, even at €20 / m you would have €3000 / month to maintain the communal asset.  POOL. If it is to cost that much and with so many with their own, lets fill it in.

I've just sent invoices to all my neighbours in my cul de sac, (last month I cleared snow from their footpaths, and pushed their dustbins back on Tuesdays)

Guess what?

Nobody wants to pay................

Can't understand why they wont pay? 

Ok, so there is still some dissatisfaction over the charges, for what it's worth here are my thoughts.

The Community Charge should be separate form any Utility Charges as it was in 2009 and should only be used for the Community such as the Pool and the charge is made compulsory. We know this should only happen when SJ hand the Estate over but this needs to be done now otherwise we make no progress. How has this money been previously spent especially as the Pools are still out of order ? The suspicion is this money was used to pay the oustanding Utility charges which no doubt were largely incurred by the Residents. However, those people who paid nothing yet still used the Utilities haven't helped the situation. Until accounts are available to identify what was spent the doubt still exists.

In 2009 a Non Resident was asked to pay 20 Euros as a Community Charge and 40 Euros as a Utility cost. A Resident paid the same Community Charge but paid 60 or 70 Euros per month, yet this year the charge of only 30 Euros per month has been agreed for Residents. So you can see why non Residents are suspicious if Residents are paying les than half of what they paid last year and less than what non Residents paid last year.

My recommendation would be we All pay the same Community Charge of between 20-60 Euros per month and that Residents pay 60 Euros per month and non Resdients pay 30 Euros per month for Utilities. That way there is transparency and fairness re all charges and usage and the Community Charge is spnet on items like the Pools. Until then I'm afraid there will continue to be disharmony which is not in the best interest of the estate. 

Hi,

Re; chef62's comments;  we are starting to hear a little common sense at last?

But I still don't follow the logic entirely, why state that we will see no progress if community fees aren't paid (whatever the level community fees are set at) community fees are not contributing to the progress of the site. That's the entire point and the problem.

With no community assets to look after or maintain what are we all paying for, why have residents started messing about with the pools, pumps, electricity etc, its not their resonsibility its SJ's.

Several questions: Why would any COMMUNITY charge need to be as high as €10 never mind €20 / m when its only a pool to take care of?  Why should anybody pay a monthly utility charge?  Particularly a non res. Many months of using NOTHING.

Why do Elche charge rates when you can't live there?

How can San Jose   -    still solvent avoid their contractual obligations?

In the U.K our heating / lighting / cooking bills ( provided by the  Russians (British gas) and Germans (E.on)  at inflated prices) for a small detached house with 4 people living in it are £45 / 50 / wk. no subsidies, not even a winter allowence.

Anyway..    Arrived today, it was cold and  grey to start with, but seemed to warm up in the early evening. I can report that the street lights are up and that there were lots of motorhomes in the car park near the beach.

Put my air-con on to warm the place......NO HEAT    mmmmmmmmmmmm    NO REAL POWER in the electricity

What the .............are we being asked to pay for?   Stuff them   GET SJ INTO BANKRUPTCY

It looks like SJ may be heading for liquidation . Although it looked  for a while that they would be able to trade on. It now seems this is no longer the case and  they will have to go to the next stage which will be a creditors agreement that will be voted on by creditors.They need to get at least 50% of all creditors including purchasers waiting for properties to vote to accept their proposal for repayment to  avoid liquidation. They must also prove to the judge  that they can deliver what is in the agreement .

Not sure why Victor thinks them going into liquidation would be a good thing for El Pinet I think it may be disastrous.MM

to  MM

What have you heard, been  told, your sources etc.

Would that release the money SJ gave to Elche?

Hi, just come back from El Pinet.

Progress is happening at spanish speed - the lighting is almost complete and ready to be fully connected, and speaking to some of the more informed residents - those who have actually spoken to the mayor of Elche, for instance, it seems that the site is on course to be completed late april although that will suprise all of us!! However, we did get positive vibes - the roads will take a few days to surface, then water and electrics will be mains connected allowing for habitation certificates. 

At present the community is disputing water bills on two fronts - one that the builders are using it and secondly, there is vast wastage still occurring due to the builder's bad workmanship.

There are movements also to try to get water meters installed earlier than completion.

I agree to some extent that the amount being paid by residents and non-residents appears disproportionate however, for the sake of completion I am willing to pay the required amount until the community is complete and we have our own water and electric meters.

While I can empathise with some of the more vociferous non residents a few things are worth bearing in mind.

Anyone who buys a property abroad not expecting to pay substantial bills is being rather naieve. Moreover, while the residents have been living free for the period, they have been living on a building site, but we have also had free use of utilities for a substantial amount of time.

We are all indebted to the residents who have been fighting our causes and unlike oursleves, who see El pinet as an investment of holiday home, for some it is their very survival that is on the line and it is through no fault of theirs or ours that we are in such a mess.

Until the site is complete we are all living in limbo. I am quite content to pay what is a relatively small community charge to see my property legalised. Like everyone else we have paid a goodly sum for our homes. There are properties on El Pinet for sale at 150,000 euros but then we are in a global credit crunch and no-one in their right mind will buy a property without a habitation certificate. This still represents a sizeable profit due to the current  exchange rate. Once the community is complete values should improve drastically. There are already signs that building investment is improving in spain with the spanish now buying on new estates and the likes of Taylor Wimpy selling 200 homes in the last year alone.

There will always be difficulties forming a new community, and yes mistakes have been made partcularly with regard to transparency and communication - receipts for bills are seen by the communal president by the way. ( whether they are accurate or reflecting claw back payments we may never know - it is spain!!)

Personally speaking, paying 60 euros community charge over the next few months is trifling compared to what we have invested in El pinet.

The Mayor of Elche is committed to getting the site completed as soon as possible and as well done as possible. Sadly the place is beginning to look tired and, as a community, we need to progress and get our habitation certificates as soon as possible so that we can all settle down or move on.

Thank you Leomack, some positive and encouraging news. I too shall continue paying. I have not missed a payment since first being asked. I don't intend doing so now, with the end hopefully in site. I still feel hearfelt sympathy for those with no or half-built properties. Perhaps the committee will turn their attention to the plight of these people once the HCs' are granted. Bill

BREAKING NEWS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just heard that all water and electrics have been cut off in El Pinet.

I personally feel heartfelt sick for all the residents.

Perhaps now people will grasp the difficulty we are all in and start pulling together before we all lose everything!!!

Leomack 

If that's the case it is a disaster for everyone. I know it's not England but.........if it was, the Utility Companies would be fighting to get the business and we would all be hooked up pretty quickly then at least Residents and Non Residents could occupy their properties without fear of no Water and Electric.

If Mr Mayor is so keen to see the completion maybe this will expediate matters. What I don't understand is the role of the Administrator or the previous Concursal to reach an amicable agreement going forward since their appointment. 

I am advised that for a change its only the houses that have been cut off.

Apartments o.k. at present.

does anyone know if the situation changed

Yes, all back on. SJ has put €30,000 towards the bills. Apparently we have to pay it back !!  One cent a week anyone ??   Bill